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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    Appleton, Wisconsin U.S.A.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SNUNEZ View Post
    I am having a problem with a TB 302 ,I believe I posted this here before but didn't get any help, here it goes Intermittent arc . LWS have replaced brushes and a board stil have problems. One LWS told me to take it back when I am having issues with it ""I said intermittent" may not act up when they have it .Hello MILLER can you help? All I use at my own shop is true blue and also at the day job so please help.
    Thanks for letting us know. Can you send us your contact information via private message so we can get in touch with you directly?

    Thanks,
    Miller Welding Forums Administrator

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Edmonton, Alberta
    Posts
    7,846

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    Quote Originally Posted by SNUNEZ View Post
    I am having a problem with a TB 302 ,I believe I posted this here before but didn't get any help, here it goes Intermittent arc . LWS have replaced brushes and a board stil have problems. One LWS told me to take it back when I am having issues with it ""I said intermittent" may not act up when they have it .Hello MILLER can you help? All I use at my own shop is true blue and also at the day job so please help.
    Because its intermitant, I'd guess that it has something to do with your cables, best to yank on the connections and clean the green corrosion from them. Are you using spools?, Another thing is that you really want that engine to be tuned to 62.5hz, too low and your going to have problems as well, Too high and same thing

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    Edmonton, Alberta
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    Intermitant problems are difficult o find, however it won't be a $$ board, or generator issue. Often a simple loose or corroded connector. Best to use a Dielectric grease in ALL molex connections to the boards

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    730

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    Quote Originally Posted by cruizer View Post
    Intermitant problems are difficult o find, however it won't be a $$ board, or generator issue. Often a simple loose or corroded connector. Best to use a Dielectric grease in ALL molex connections to the boards
    Cruizer,
    You reccomend dielectric grease in all molex connections to the boards. I have found a few articles which may be of interest.

    To Prevent Electrical Problems:

    1.Avoid silicone sprays.

    1.Use a good spray cleaner like DeoxIT D5 Connector & Contact Treatment. This breaks up the oxides and contamination. This is only a cleaner and the cleaning improves conductivity.

    2.Use an electrical contact enhancer like Stabilant 22 or Stabilant 22A. Initially it is non-conductive and then switches to a conductor in the presence of electricity. This switching ability is set so that the material will remain non-conductive between adjacent contacts in a multiple connector, and yet enhance the conductivity of each connector. It's as if it had its own brain, and it provides a tenfold to a hundredfold increase in connector reliability.

    Skip this paragraph if you're not technical. Stabilant 22 is a potentially electricly-active material which through a synergistic combination of effects enhances conductivity within a contact without causing leakage between adjacent contacts. While Stabilant 22 has a high dielectric constant it acts to form a capacitive layer which is in parallel with whatever residual resistance exists in the contact increasing the passage of AC signals. However, given sufficient DC bias within the gaps of the contact the thin film of Stabilant 22 will "switch" to conducting by quantum tunneling and thus limit the resistance of the contact to a serviceable level.

    Nick

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    730

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    Cruizer,
    Here is another. I have seen conflicting opinions. Please let me know what you think.
    Thanks,
    Nick

    As written by Wayne Orwig, MGNOC Georgia State Rep.

    Using Dielectric Grease on connectors.

    A lot of people use dielectric grease on connectors. Some people mistakenly believe that dieletric grease is a conductor. In fact, it is just the opposite; it is an insulator. Dielectric grease is typically made of silicone grease.

    As an insulator, dielectric grease is good for use on spark plug boots. This was one of the original applications on vehicles when the high-energy ignition systems came out. It can help insulate the connector and, in particular on a motorcycle where it can get wet, it waterproofs the spark plug boot. And, because it is silicone, it is fairly stable at high temperatures and won't affect the rubber and plastics.

    So why would you put an insulator on a connector? The idea is that you use a thin layer. When you push the connector together the grease is pushed out of the way enough to get a connection and the surrounding grease then keeps out water and oxygen. The connector will be protected from the environment and less likely to corrode. Plus, the silicone is safe for the plastics and PVC insulation.

    That sounds good, so far; so why not smear it on everything? Well there are a number of good reasons.

    First, silicone grease outgases constantly. If the silicone gas gets near a connector or a contact, such as a relay, and there is a spark, the spark at the contact can create silicon dioxide. Some people even suggest that the silicone gas from dielectric grease can travel many feet through the unsulation on a wire and damage a contact on the other end. Omron states that even their sealed switches can be damaged by nearby silicone grease outgassing. Reference the following links for more info:

    http://www.omron.com/ecb/products/pdf/en-d2vw.pdf

    http://machinedesign.com/article/lub...-switches-1025

    Second, it is an insulator. It can prevent contacts from touching. If you do use it, use a very thin layer.

    Third, if you have a corroded connection, silicone grease will not help. In fact, it may make it worse. It can never improve anything. Dielectric grease will never make a poor connection better.

    Fourth, it attracts dust and dirt and it hardens over time. This means that if you smear a lot of silicone grease on connectors you may see nearby relays, switches, or points fail later on. Since silicone grease does nothing at all to improve the connection and, in fact, may insulate the contacts in the connector increasing the resistance the connector may still fail.

    So what do you do? Look for a contact enhancer/lube. While most contact cleaners are simple solvents that just wash the connector off there are contact enhancers that deoxidize the contact surface and actually work to lower the contact resistance (make a better connection). Most contact enhancers leave a lubricant behind that protects the metal and continue to deoxidize the metal and improve the connection. They can work to lower the resistance and make a better contact as time goes by. The best you can hope for from dielectric grease is that it seals it enough to not get worse. I have used Caig Deoxit on my bikes for a few years now. I first found out about this on my job when I had to correct an issue in a connector system that could not tolerate even 5 thousandths of an ohm of resistance drift. We had a connector in the field that had been improperly plated and was starting to drift, mostly in warm humid areas like Florida. Our testing showed that the Caig Deoxit could be a good long-term fix. We ended up using the Deoxit to stabilize the bad units until we could get corrected wiring harnesses built with the correct connectors. We also put a layer of Deoxit on the new parts to protect and keep them clean over their lifetime. This solved the drift issue that we had.

    I still use a small amount of silicone grease on my spark plug caps. It helps to waterproof them and makes it easier to pull the cap off, but I use it in very small amounts and never near a relay or switch.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    Edmonton, Alberta
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    Those are pretty long reads. Now EVERYONE USES dielectric (silicone) grease to basically prevent corrosion of pins and such. With the exception of ribbon cables) IT dos not conduct, and that is a good thing, I don't see your reasoning NOT to use it. Posting that material is kinda pointless.
    Last edited by cruizer; 05-11-2014 at 10:34 AM.

  7. #17
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    Aug 2007
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    730

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    Quote Originally Posted by cruizer View Post
    Those are pretty long reads. Now EVERYONE USES dielectric (silicone) grease to basically prevent corrosion of pins and such. With the exception of ribbon cables) IT dos not conduct, and that is a good thing, I don't see your reasoning NOT to use it. Posting that material is kinda pointless.
    It was not meant to be pointless. I have put dielectric grease on my connectors for some time now since I have been following you on the forum. My buddies asked me why I did this and I showed them your posts. They shot me back a few articles so I thought I would ask you about them since I have very limited experience in this area.

  8. #18

  9. #19
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    Oct 2004
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    Edmonton, Alberta
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi View Post
    It was not meant to be pointless. I have put dielectric grease on my connectors for some time now since I have been following you on the forum. My buddies asked me why I did this and I showed them your posts. They shot me back a few articles so I thought I would ask you about them since I have very limited experience in this area.
    Well, just can't be bothered with reading extra long articles. Many pins in the molex connections have disimular properties. Thus they corrode, and cause resistance. Resistance causes problems to the boards. I started using dielectric on all molex fittings some 35 years ago, especially during aircraft maintenance wear corrosion is rampant. Now pulling a connector and putting it back on reseats the pins. So the component may work again, but for how long. Dielectric assures me, that the component 's pins will retain a good connection and not corrode

    All the Brands use it now to help prevent board failure, and I use it during preventative maintenance.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    730

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    I appreciate the explanation.
    Thanks,
    Nick

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