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  1. #1
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    Default Wimpy torch on Dynasty 280 DX

    My new Dynasty 280 DX if I'm not mistaken is rated at 280 amp peak on AC or DC. The torch Miller supplies with their kit, and recommends if component, is the Weldcraft W280 Super Cool. I'm one of those nuts who reads manuals. It says 280 amps DC, 195 amps AC. I,m disappointed. Thicker aluminum will require all the heat I can muster. I'll be limited with a handicap of 85 amps.
    Do I now have to buy a heavier kit for heavy aluminum? What melts on these torches when I exceed rated amperage?
    I feel like I did years ago when i bought my first heavy duty truck. I wanted snow tires. The dealer (a small rural dealer) agreed to swap for snows for a fee. The tires he supplied were load range C, mine were load range E. His response was "You won't be carrying much weight, no problem." I went off the deep end! You mean I paid thousands extra for a heavy duty truck, hundreds extra for tires, and you want to limit me to half ton loads?
    What are other owners doing about this?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Milan Michigan
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    1,705

    Default

    Willie, That is why I didn't buy the package back when I bought my 300, I didn't want to settle on what the package supplies.

    I have a Speedway Torch SW320 and its the most flexible one Ive ever used verses what I used to have on a 250 synchrowave.

    There's nothing worse than having to fight with a stiff torch ( Not that yours is )

    But don't settle for a junk torch.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Wa
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    557

    Default

    You will only have issues if you plan to run at high amperage for an extended weld time. I doubt you will ever notice.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
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    3,150

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    My new Dynasty 280 DX if I'm not mistaken is rated at 280 amp peak on AC or DC. The torch Miller supplies with their kit, and recommends if component, is the Weldcraft W280 Super Cool. I'm one of those nuts who reads manuals. It says 280 amps DC, 195 amps AC. I,m disappointed. Thicker aluminum will require all the heat I can muster. I'll be limited with a handicap of 85 amps.
    Do I now have to buy a heavier kit for heavy aluminum? What melts on these torches when I exceed rated amperage?
    I feel like I did years ago when i bought my first heavy duty truck. I wanted snow tires. The dealer (a small rural dealer) agreed to swap for snows for a fee. The tires he supplied were load range C, mine were load range E. His response was "You won't be carrying much weight, no problem." I went off the deep end! You mean I paid thousands extra for a heavy duty truck, hundreds extra for tires, and you want to limit me to half ton loads?
    What are other owners doing about this?
    Willie

    those ratings of 280 amps DC, 195 amps AC are at %100 duty cycle..

    so I do not believe you have anything to worry about...
    the torch has a higher duty cycle than the welder (see page 16 )

    http://www.millerwelds.com/om/o253086e_mil.pdf

    here is the torch data sheet..

    http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_sheets/AY30-0.pdf
    Last edited by H80N; 03-31-2014 at 09:16 AM.
    .

    *******************************************
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know......

    “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

    Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

    My Blue Stuff:
    Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200DX
    Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
    Millermatic 200

    TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam..

  5. #5
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    Default

    I guess I'll cross the bridge when I come to it. I am curious how AC generates more heat than DC. Why the dual rating? As those of us welding only DC would likely opt for a Maxstar, and those of us wanting less than 200 amps AC would likely opt for a Dynasty 200, why recommend a 195 amp torch? I understood this torch had been developed expressly for the 280 because 250s weren't adequate. Have they underrated the torch to avoid warranty claims? I read the 280/195 amp ratings are contingent on pairing it with a Coolmate 4. It is Miller who paired it with a Coolmate 1.3! Miller is not the company I would have expected to behave in this way!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
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    Lake of the Ozarks MO
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by H80N View Post
    Willie

    those ratings of 280 amps DC, 195 amps AC are at %100 duty cycle..

    so I do not believe you have anything to worry about...
    the torch has a higher duty cycle than the welder (see page 16 )

    http://www.millerwelds.com/om/o253086e_mil.pdf

    here is the torch data sheet..

    http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_sheets/AY30-0.pdf

    Totally agree with this
    This torch is plenty for this machine
    Burn it up and you may be tripping the thermal on the welder!
    Miller knows what they are doing. Just not always cheap.
    A bigger torch is NOT comfortable to use btw.

    www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
    Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
    MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
    Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

    Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
    Miller 30-A Spoolgun
    Miller WC-115-A
    Miller Spectrum 300
    Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
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  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
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    Default

    That torch has PLENTY of capacity for the Dynasty 280DX..

    just compare the duty cycle specs...

    Derating the torch for AC is normal because during the positive half of the cycle most of the heat is going into the tungsten and thus into the torch..

    During DCEN most of the heat is going into the workpiece....so it can carry more amps than it would for AC...
    Last edited by H80N; 03-31-2014 at 06:41 PM.
    .

    *******************************************
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know......

    “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

    Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

    My Blue Stuff:
    Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200DX
    Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
    Millermatic 200

    TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam..

  8. #8
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by H80N View Post
    That torch has PLENTY of capacity for the Dynasty 280DX..

    just compare the duty cycle specs...

    Derating the torch for AC is normal because during the positive half of the cycle most of the heat is going into the tungsten and thus into the torch..

    During DCEN most of the heat is going into the workpiece....so it can carry more amps than it would for AC...
    OK then, good clean aluminum, you might run near 90% EN on heavy material, not so very much heat back at the torch. I realize I am probably overreacting. Welding in the range of 280 amps seems a very rare thing for me. I saw the Diversion 180 as a mistake for me to have bought, then I realize my new super welder that cost a staggering sum is severely limited by a torch, to a level only slightly greater than the Diversion! I've paid $600. for a torch who's manufacturer says won't do the job! Had I paired torch to welder I'd be crushed, filled with self loathing. When the manufacturer does it I say WTF?

  9. #9
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    Default

    Dude
    You are so not getting this!
    The duty cycle on the torch is higher than the duty cycle on the welder.
    I'm using nearly the same thing on my 700!
    This is how it has been forever. The torch on the Diversion is rated way less as well.
    All that being said, run the crap out of it! It's very doubtful you can feed enuff rod to even come close to duty cycle. It takes a LOT of very long and hot beads to do that. I would have that machine set on 280 more than one would think!
    You have a very nice awesome package there and once you have used it for awhile you will fully realize just how capable it really is

    www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
    Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
    MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
    Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

    Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
    Miller 30-A Spoolgun
    Miller WC-115-A
    Miller Spectrum 300
    Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
    SPEEDGLAS 9100XX

  10. #10
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FusionKing View Post
    Dude
    You are so not getting this!
    The duty cycle on the torch is higher than the duty cycle on the welder.
    I'm using nearly the same thing on my 700!
    This is how it has been forever. The torch on the Diversion is rated way less as well.
    All that being said, run the crap out of it! It's very doubtful you can feed enuff rod to even come close to duty cycle. It takes a LOT of very long and hot beads to do that. I would have that machine set on 280 more than one would think!
    You have a very nice awesome package there and once you have used it for awhile you will fully realize just how capable it really is
    I'm sure that both of you are right. As Weldcraft is now Miller, I wish they had expressed it in a different way. Perhaps 195 amps at 100% duty, tapering to 10% at 280. I would be very comfortable with that. The notion of not to exceed 195 was shocking to me. I presume warranty will be void if I melt it.
    Has anyone melted one? What exactly fails? The size of the cable inside the water hose seems way too small, but a stream of water each pound absorbing perhaps 120 BTU will absorb heat. As I plead to my local power company over the last 45 years; if overhead cables were sized so they didn't produce so much heat, less energy would be wasted, you won't have to waste time trying to convince me that the wind blowing the heat away is the same as not generating it.Power quality would improve, less than perfect connections wouldn't burn off. Mrs. Jones would stop pestering her electrician about her computer misbehaving, and I would stop pestering employees of the power company about Mrs. Jones. You could build smaller power plants, less pollution, less global warming! Polar bears would be happy! Seal populations would be in natural balance. God would be in his heaven, and all would be right with the world! Best of all; power company employees would never have to listen to my speech again!

    I digress! Am I over dramatizing?

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