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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    5

    Default Welding Titanium Question

    Hey everyone,

    New here, but Ive done a good amount of searching around I still have a question.
    I've been welding Chromoly and aluminum for about 3 yrs, self taught and i have had the opportunity to learn to weld Ti at work. i purchased a large gas lens set up and a #15 cup and I made some purge plugs and am back purging the weld area. The weld color is acceptable from what i understand (silver/straw) but i am getting slight discoloration away from the weld bead area (see picture) is this okay? or is this just as bad as discoloration in the weld? If its bad any possible solutions you can recommend? Thanks!

    - Conor

    .035 Ti Tubing
    Machine set to 80ish amps
    1/16 tungsten (ceriated)
    pre flow .5s
    post flow (ive tried up to 15seconds)
    Torch flow (25cfh)
    ti weld.jpg
    torch.jpg
    purge.jpg

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    569

    Default

    I have never welded Ti but I would say that is not a problem and I would have even expected more.

    Less color may be desired but I doubt possible. I know some like a purge box to put the entire part in.

    By any chance can you remember slowing down in the areas with the most purple? Well after looking at it again you can tell its towards the ends of your run where the heat was building.

    My response isn't helping you but I'd like to learn more about it also. If I get involved and get slapped around a bit, maybe I'll remember.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    305

    Default

    That bead it pretty spaced out. Tighten it up also the leg length looks way oversized for .035 wall tubing. Turn down the amps.
    Miller syncrowave 200 runner with coolmate 4
    and wp2025 weldcraft torch
    Miller 125c plasma cutter

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    5

    Default

    So weld in shorter spurts, tighten up puddle spacing, and i'm not using near all the 80 amps its just what the machine was set at but ill turn it down anyhow. Thanks for the responses so far if anyone has any other input the more the merrier!!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Sierra Nevada
    Posts
    40

    Default

    As a self taught welder you have probably tried different techniques. As with any other material choose wisely the type and thickness of the filler metal. As for the cup...well...thin wall like the .035 would be better suited with the cup size and type your using. If you get the chance to weld thicker parts, like .250 to 1.0 I would suggest ditching the gas lense and shoot with a straight 8
    The material has a low rate of thermal conductivity. The thicker, the easier. With the thinner parts like the tubing in your pic remember that the filler metal has a tremendous impact on the overall heat input of that part.
    In other words, the more filler, the more heat. Remember that Ti and Argon have an affinity for one another. But all good things in moderation.
    The last point I will make is to watch "the glow" in the puddle. At a certain point the glow or brightness dissipates and its time to move, don't soak the puddle too long, and try not to move too slow and compensate with widely spaced beads.
    In my opinion Ti is easier to weld than stainless steel. But dirty aluminum is the mother of all evil.
    Last edited by Electric4Life; 09-06-2013 at 06:35 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Milan Michigan
    Posts
    1,670

    Default

    Electric for life, Theres a step below dirty aluminum, Its, Dirty magnesium.

    A agree with who ever said that the puddle has the ripples to far apart.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    5

    Default

    Wow! Lots of great info here!! Thanks! I can't wait to get back at it next week, so just to clarify though, if done proper I shouldn't see the discoloration outside of the weld area? How much does it effect the material? I want these and all of my Ti welds to be on point when we start sending product out the door. Also I think the filler rod was 1/16 but I'd have to check when I get back to work.

    -Conor


    Quote Originally Posted by Electric4Life View Post
    As a self taught welder you have probably tried different techniques. As with any other material choose wisely the type and thickness of the filler metal. As for the cup...well...thin wall like the .035 would be better suited with the cup size and type your using. If you get the chance to weld thicker parts, like .250 to 1.0 I would suggest ditching the gas lense and shoot with a straight 8
    The material has a low rate of thermal conductivity. The thicker, the easier. With the thinner parts like the tubing in your pic remember that the filler metal has a tremendous impact on the overall heat input of that part.
    In other words, the more filler, the more heat. Remember that Ti and Argon have an affinity for one another. But all good things in moderation.
    The last point I will make is to watch "the glow" in the puddle. At a certain point the glow or brightness dissipates and its time to move, don't soak the puddle too long, and try not to move too slow and compensate with widely spaced beads.
    In my opinion Ti is easier to weld than stainless steel. But dirty aluminum is the mother of all evil.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Sierra Nevada
    Posts
    40

    Default

    As far as an "acceptable" weld on Ti, that is entirely up to the manufacturing engineer or the customers specs. Unlike other materials titaniums welding requirements are industry specific. Normally the procedures are developed by the engineers that design the parts themselves.
    My first experience with this type of material was in Aerospace. Color is the primary determining factor of how well the welding process was performed.
    You mentioned "straw" coloration. This would have been rejected. Nitric Acid etching would remove a specific amount of material and the process would be repeated.
    Look online for the "color schedules" that some companies refer to as a guide. I believe most welding procedures as well as the procedures for the "removal" of the color varies.
    Your welds should be just fine. Coloration forms when the weld and the surrounding material is getting too much atmosphere before it reaches a low enough temperature not to oxidize. In other words, its the same challenge as getting "color" on stainless but in this case, "no color" is the goal.
    Removal of the unwanted color is all you really have to do to ensure the best weld quality. If you see blue or purple its not the end of the world. Just stay away from grey or brown. I've even seen white, that was on thicker material however. But mechanically removing the oxide is normal. Wire brushing can be good/ok. Just use quality brushes that are clean and aren't too warn out. A stray wire in the weld puddle will get annoying.
    Sand blasting and etching are the best ways to remove discoloration from the surface.
    As far as achieving good color, Ti doesn't seem to wet in like other ferrous materials. To me, it behaves more like Al. So be aware of soaking too long and roll back of the throttle as you "drop" the temp as you move forward with the arc, not the puddle. Its minute but if Im making any sense you'll see this under the hood. Faster and steadier. Good luck.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    5

    Default

    Electric4Life

    Thanks a bunch!!

    - Conor

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    95

    Default

    Try cleaning the whole area that will be in the heat affected zone. The color may have come from heat and residue left on the tube. And plenty of acetone.

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