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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    23

    Default

    WOW.... so i guess i have not herd of the dual sheild before. So as far as flux core goes i could probly ask my welding supplier but it seems you all have more time using it than they would what type should i get? i do weld on equipment every now and then like excivator buckets and so on. what is the best tinsle stregnth? or what have you guys found that works the best for heavy equipment?

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Williams Lake, British Columbia
    Posts
    722

    Default

    Why wont you try them both and see which one you like the best. Me, I cant stand the spatter and harder to remove slag of the self-shield fluxcore.
    Last edited by Daniel; 10-11-2011 at 05:21 PM.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    northern NJ
    Posts
    1,846

    Default

    The following are just my opinions from my experience.

    I like dual shield best for in the shop. My preference is ESAB 7100 ultra. I have run 1/16" & .045. I like to run it with straight CO2 better than a 75/25 mix. The dual shield is wind sensitive so using it outside creates problems unless you are willing to "tent up", make wind blocks, etc. Most of the time there is always some kind of breeze where I am.

    For in the field I like to use Hobart Fabshield 21B. I used to use Lincoln NR212 but IMO the Hobart runs nicer at least on my machine. I have also heard good things about Lincoln NR232 but have never used it. It is nice to just go & weld without worrying about wind issues.

    I would say that on equally clean material both wires will produce a nice looking bead with minimal clean up. The innershield produces more smoke in the air.

    I should add that on 3/16"-1/4" & thinner in the shop I prefer bare wire over dual shield.
    Last edited by MMW; 10-13-2011 at 04:52 PM. Reason: added last sentance to clarify.
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  4. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel View Post
    Before you go on and call people ignorant you should read and understand .
    The engineers, where I work are telling us to use this gas shielded fluxcore "" which is ultracore from Lincoln " because it is the best for our heavy equipment repair, electric shovels and drills etc..
    I think if they could they would tell us to use self-shielded fluxcore.
    Plus as a bonus it doesn't spatter like most self-shielded fluxcore.

    But hey, what do I know.


    I did. And I do.
    That's fine that you use what you're told to use.
    But your comments (specially about mechanicals) was, ignorant of the facts. Period.
    Everyone on the planet is ignorant on many topics. What's a little annoying is when people post online about topics they don't have a good grasp of.
    If you have a splatter problem with ss fcaw then you're doing it wrong.
    Despite the engineers at the company you work for there are an awfull lot of shovel dippers and car bodies, blast hole drills, haul truck frames and beds, etc welded every day with ss fcaw.

    JT

    I'll add that I'm fairly ignorant (happily) on calculus and triginometry. But for me to post on the interweb that "we use trig at work, calculus just isn't good enough" would be silly and make me look even dumber than I am.
    Right tool, right job, right place. It's really that simple.
    Last edited by JTMcC; 10-13-2011 at 02:49 PM.
    Some days you eat the bear. And some days the bear eats you.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Alberta Canada.
    Posts
    8

    Thumbs down

    Well I've been a journeyman structural welder for 3 decades now and not too often do I see innershield being used. A lot of money is spent hoarding in the weld area to allow the use of shielding gas, that also adds to the expence. Even when I worked in a shop that manufactured bridge girders we only used dual shield. They tried new innershield wires as they came out but always went back to dual shield. They must be ignorant. The only common application I know is hard surfacing in the oilsands with stoody wire other than that Sucore and Syncrude use dual shield. What do they know. When we built the coal bunkers at the unit 3 powerstation at Keephills it was dual shield except for the stainless which was solid wire with argon. I hate when people make ignorant claims that innershield is just as good. Or is there something that Suncore,Syncrude,Alstom power,Tansalta,Epcore, Capital power, or the minister of transportation and highways missing? I don't argue that innershield can produce passable welds but I don't know of anyone that wants to use it. If thats your cup of tea then fill your boots.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Alberta Canada.
    Posts
    8

    Default

    I never heard of anyone not getting spatter with innershield. I get a lot of smoke as well. Mabey if I knew how to weld properly I could eliminate that too.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Williams Lake, British Columbia
    Posts
    722

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JTMcC View Post
    I did. And I do.
    That's fine that you use what you're told to use.
    But your comments (specially about mechanicals) was, ignorant of the facts. Period.
    Everyone on the planet is ignorant on many topics. What's a little annoying is when people post online about topics they don't have a good grasp of.
    If you have a splatter problem with ss fcaw then you're doing it wrong.
    Despite the engineers at the company you work for there are an awfull lot of shovel dippers and car bodies, blast hole drills, haul truck frames and beds, etc welded every day with ss fcaw.

    JT

    I'll add that I'm fairly ignorant (happily) on calculus and triginometry. But for me to post on the interweb that "we use trig at work, calculus just isn't good enough" would be silly and make me look even dumber than I am.
    Right tool, right job, right place. It's really that simple.
    Well I'm good at calculus and trigononetry, I have to be I'm a journeyman welder/fabricator.
    As for the innershield, I'v used it and absolutaly dont care for it. If I'd be a sub-contractor doing structural and want to save some money maybe, and I mean structural.

    You look like you feel very powerfull behind your keyboard calling people names, and that shows what type of man you are.

    Keep up the good work Sir.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Salem ,Ohio
    Posts
    3,908

    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by rollinstones View Post
    I don't argue that innershield can produce passable welds but I don't know of anyone that wants to use it.
    Innershield isn't my go to wire at any level, but i did see on the History Channel a while back on welding skyscrapers in the big cities. And innershield was the only wire used welding together the big beams that looked to be 2 or more inches thick. It also said on how much money was saved by not having to change rods and the wasted stubs in stick welding. It showed the welders with big mig guns with heat shields on the front with no nozzle on the gun. It was interesting to see as i never would have thought that...Bob
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  9. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel View Post
    Well I'm good at calculus and trigononetry, I have to be I'm a journeyman welder/fabricator.
    As for the innershield, I'v used it and absolutaly dont care for it. If I'd be a sub-contractor doing structural and want to save some money maybe, and I mean structural.

    You look like you feel very powerfull behind your keyboard calling people names, and that shows what type of man you are.

    Keep up the good work Sir.



    Uh, nobody called you any names.
    You don't like the wire. We get it. I'd rather not run any wire myself but do from time to time and I can appreciate the advantages in certain circumstances of a lot of different wires wether I want to use them or not.
    But when you say the wire is no good you defy the facts.
    Don't overcomplicate this and don't make it a personal thing. I'm simply pointing out that a lot of critical welds are made with FCAW (in several fields), regardless of anybody's personal opinion of the wires.
    People who've only run the 211 type wires and never used 232, 203N, 311N (or the Hobart/Esab equivelents) won't realize the large differences that exist in FC.
    Most of the splatter coments probably come from people who've used 211 or 21b.

    JT
    Some days you eat the bear. And some days the bear eats you.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Williams Lake, British Columbia
    Posts
    722

    Default

    I'm not complicating anything, I've simply stated that gas-shielded FC is a better wire to work with in my book. As I use wire day in and day out, 12 hours a day.
    You ask me to define I defined. Now move along.

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