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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    8

    Default Silicon Bronze Food Safe?

    OK, I've asked on here a few times about welding Copper to Stainless. I've been told that Silicon Bronze will work. So a couple of questions.

    1. Is it food safe, and if it is please direct me to where an MSDS says so.
    2. Can I MIG weld Copper to Stainless using Silicon Bronze MIG Wire?

    Thanks.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Milan Michigan
    Posts
    1,672

    Default

    I pretty sure silicon bronze is a pour choice, The silicon bronze will stick to the copper just fine but not to the stainless.

    20 plus years ago I used my oxy/ acyt. torch to braze some stainless to stainless and the stainless welded okay at first and then it just popped away.

    Silver solder with a 45% silver content is what I use to join the 2 together, There are at least 2 types of flux to use, you want to get high temp flux because the silver melts at a higher temputure.

    I'm not sure if silver solder would be considered food grade or not.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    265

    Default From the Food Code 2009>FDA Food Code 2009 Chapter 4

    4-101.14 Copper, Use Limitation.
    (A) Except as specified in (B) of this section, copper and copper alloys such as brass may not be used in contact with a food that has a pH below 6 such as vinegar, fruit juice, or wine or for a fitting or tubing installed between a backflow prevention device and a carbonator. P
    (B) Copper and copper alloys may be used in contact with beer brewing ingredients that have a pH below 6 in the prefermentation and fermentation steps of a beer brewing operation such as a brewpub or microbrewery.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Plainview, TX
    Posts
    334

    Default Silicon Bronze and Stainless NSF/ANSI 61 for Drinking Water

    NSF/ANSI Standard 61 Drinking Water System Components - Health Effects is the standard that establishes minimum health effects requirements for materials, components, products, or systems that contact drinking water, drinking water treatment chemicals, or both.
    Most Silicon Bronze and Stainless Steel products that meet this standard are mechanically joined. I have only seen stainless materials welded, bronze products were always machined.
    Food Grade Materials would have the approriate NSF/FDA label attached.
    Copper and Stainless are used in manufacturing of food grade products, but silicon bronze is only used in water related components, like your water pump and spigots.
    The silicon in the silicon bronze is there to replace lead that used to be used in bronze products.
    Sounds like you need to Google some NSF and FDA standard on acceptable food grade metal materials and recommended joining practices. I think you may also find that the MIG process is not used in the making of components and items that come into contact with food.
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    In wal-mart
    Posts
    460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dipsomaniac View Post
    4-101.14 Copper, Use Limitation.
    (A) Except as specified in (B) of this section, copper and copper alloys such as brass may not be used in contact with a food that has a pH below 6 such as vinegar, fruit juice, or wine or for a fitting or tubing installed between a backflow prevention device and a carbonator. P
    (B) Copper and copper alloys may be used in contact with beer brewing ingredients that have a pH below 6 in the prefermentation and fermentation steps of a beer brewing operation such as a brewpub or microbrewery.


    Yeah they dont use brass in microbreweries either, because lead is in brass for machinability and leaches into the beer. Brewing and fermenting in copper pots can be a health hazard, this is the reason microbreweries use stainless, and just copper clad the outside of the brew kettle and fermentation vessels for looks, as well as to seal in the glycol piping. Just thought Id throw that out their.
    If you want peace, be prepared for war!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    265

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by usmcruz View Post
    Yeah they dont use brass in microbreweries either, because lead is in brass for machinability and leaches into the beer. Brewing and fermenting in copper pots can be a health hazard, this is the reason microbreweries use stainless, and just copper clad the outside of the brew kettle and fermentation vessels for looks, as well as to seal in the glycol piping. Just thought Id throw that out their.

    Lead is strictly ***** when it comes to food or drink...

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Ok, I appreciate the information, but I've been searching for answers for a long while and now I'm back to square one. Let's start over.

    I need to weld a stainless steel flange to a piece of 8" Copper Tubing. It is a STILL, YES I HAVE A DSP (Distillery Plant Permit) I am a legit Distillery. So it needs to be food safe for this kind of environment. Please help.

    I' using a Miller Dialarc Tig Welder 310 Amps, Water Cooled Torch and a 3/32 Electrode. How should I weld these? Although I'm a good welder my Tig is rather old. I do have access to a modern Tig with all the bells and whistles but it only goes to 210 Amps, but if some of the special features makes copper welding easier then that's an option.

    Thanks.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Chicago-ish
    Posts
    282

    Default

    Silver solder.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Northern CA, Shasta CO.
    Posts
    143

    Default

    No MSDS is going to have a statement like "this is safe" let alone "this is food safe" anywhere on it. Besides the fact that food safe is a terriby huge category. Are you boiling spuds or soaking olives in lye?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    8

    Default

    No, no spuds or olives. Just ethanol vapor. So what should I use.

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