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Thread: Circular Stairs

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    194

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    Quote Originally Posted by starweld View Post
    http://www.theironshop.com/vicpic_01.htm

    These guys build hundreds of these!!! Maybe they need all you critics for consultants....
    Two summers ago we installed about 30 of their kits for a G.C. in my area. We had to go back and add pickets so they met codes. My guys got to where they could put one up in about an hour(these were kits). The job made good money, but making them meet codes was even better!

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    861

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    I know people who have driven drunk hundreds of times and always seem to get home alive.

    That does not prove that drunk driving is not dangerous. It does prove, however, that every once in a while, a guy comes along who thinks that accidents and injuries are caused purely by other people's stupidity. To him, his defiance is a calculated risk and he takes no responsibility for the possible repercussions. To him, other people had just better watch out.

    And because there are people like this, I never assume I am following the rules just because I'm doing what the other guy is doing (BTW kids, that's a very important principle that will save you a lot of trouble). There's a good chance he doesn't know better and hasn't learned the hard way yet.

    To figure out if I'm following the rules, I look at the rulebook. In the case of residential stairs, the rulebook is IRC Sections R311 & R312.

    Interestingly enough, I posted the following two weeks ago after repairing a step with a 1.5" riser difference (3/8" is max allowed) that caused a trip that resulted in a 4 foot fall down the stairs for a teen. Had it been a granny, that same fall would have caused a particular injury that hastens the death of the elderly. I know because I have taken dozens and dozens of those good old folks to the ER, and transported them between the hospital and nursing home. I got to know them pretty well before they died of pneumonia from being bedridden by their broken hip.

    There are very, very few things in this world I hate more than preventable injury.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodybagger View Post
    I am on the warpath on bad stairs today because I had to correct someone's non-compliant stairs that caused a fall and injury.

    This is a very concise guide to stair requirements from the Stairway Manufacturers Association.

    http://www.arcways.com/pdfs/IRC2006.pdf

    It's not just an idea or a better way. It's code. It's not flexible and if it doesn't meet it, it is wrong.

    80% of failures are from 20% of causes
    Never compromise your principles today in the name of furthering them in the future.
    "All I ever wanted was an honest week's pay for an honest day's work." -Sgt. Bilko
    "We are generally better persuaded by reasons we discover ourselves than by those given to us by others." -Pascal
    "Since we cannot know all that there is to be known about anything, we ought to know a little about everything." -Pascal

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Rushville IN
    Posts
    50

    Default TReads

    My pictures might look like the treads are spaced far apart, but they are spaced at 7.125" and they are all within .0625.Also the treads are all.5 at the widest point. They walk really comfortable.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    360

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    I work with a guy who builds spiral stars on the side, when he's not busy working shutdowns. The following event was 2 years ago:
    Buddy (Ron) was not working at the time, and so he gets a call to quote a job in the ritzy part of the city. Not really wanting the job because shutdowns are coming up, he goes to look anyway. A 50ish year old man opens the door and takes him to the back yard. There he also meets a late 20's HOT bimbo who turns out to be the surgeon's wife. He wanted a spiral stair to go from his 1st floor deck to the second. An elaborate job from what he described. So he goes home and crunches numbers, keeping in mind that he doesn't really want the job. He said he came up with a price of $28,000 to insure he wouldn't get the job! Faxes the guy the quote and he gets a phone call "How soon can you start?". He took on the job and missed a shutdown!

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Lake of the Ozarks MO
    Posts
    3,558

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    Quote Originally Posted by starweld View Post
    http://www.theironshop.com/vicpic_01.htm

    These guys build hundreds of these!!! Maybe they need all you critics for consultants....

    They expect homeowners to purchase these not pro's. If a homeowner installs them he assumes the risk. If a pro does it he asumes the risk FOREVER!!!
    You posted these stairs up for all the world to see. Do you want us all to ACT like we think your set of steps in the first post is something that we could build and meet approval in our areas?
    I made these types of stairs thirty years ago. They were nothing new then. I have had to live with them. No one here is saying your workmanship is in question.
    Most people who have had them in their home never want another set again. You cannot hardly carry anything up or down them. They are very easy to fall down on. If you have small children or elderly people often they are just flat out dangerous.
    As for the website that you posted the set on the homepage is exactly what we have been discussing. I doubt they would pass any code anywhere.
    All any of these are IMO are just kinda cool but very dated and only good where saving space is the main consideration.
    When you are a professional working in a region that has codes you cannot simply ignore them unless you like having everything you own being taken from you while everybody around talks about it. I have lost a home in the eighties and went thru the embarrasssment of having my name posted in the newspaper and then watching it auction off on the courthouse steps. I was much more of a risktaker then
    Last edited by FusionKing; 01-01-2010 at 12:08 PM.

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  6. #26
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    Apr 2008
    Location
    Rushville IN
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    50

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    I am sorry i am not as smart as you think you are!! I just thought it was a nice piece of work, i look at some of the stuff posted and everybody raves about it, and it is sometimes les than nice. Also we are supposed to pull the log from our own eye before we pull the speck from someone elses..

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Nashville, TN
    Posts
    68

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    Starweld,
    It is a nice piece of work, I am sure it takes some time to build a set of stairs like these and I can see how you might be disappointed in some of the responses to your post.

    I have been posting on internet forums for years now and see posts that are misinterpreted as often as not - no matter how well meaning the response is. I think some of the responses you received were intended to help insure you did not acquire any unnecessary liability. The posters may have been unsure that you were aware of the applicable codes.

    The written word is often hard to deliver properly without the advantage of face to face conversation. Think of it this way - if you were at your favorite restaurant for Saturday morning breakfast with your friends that you know and respect and one of them said "Hey - I don't think that railing meets code", then the conversation might take an entirely different course.

    On discussion forums it is hard to put in perspective the knowledge or intent of the responding poster. It's easy to take offense and hard to take criticism when you don't personally know the poster.

    I think the stairs look great, I have a place at my house where they would work well due to some space limitations. They would only see occasional use and would add an interesting architectural feature to that portion of the backyard and deck. I was interested in how the work was accomplished.

    I don't think anyone was implying you did not do fine work. They just want to be sure that on down the road that you did not encounter repercussions if there were a question about the stairs meeting code.

    I hope I did not offend anyone with my response, I think there is good information in these posts, sometimes we just need to pick our way through the chaff to get to the wheat.
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  8. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
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    Lake of the Ozarks MO
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    3,558

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    Quote Originally Posted by starweld View Post
    I am sorry i am not as smart as you think you are!! I just thought it was a nice piece of work, i look at some of the stuff posted and everybody raves about it, and it is sometimes les than nice. Also we are supposed to pull the log from our own eye before we pull the speck from someone elses..
    If that is all you can respond with after I explained I was not attacking your workmanship, then there is not much else I could say to defend mine and others point of view.
    I never said I was smarter than anyone.
    I see people driving in heavy traffic on the cell phone with kids jumping up and down in the back seat. I just recognize they are stupid for ignoring the law.
    Some other dangers are just a little less obvious.
    You seem to take the stand that by recognizing that those steps would not pass hardly any code, anywhere, we believe you do shoddy work. No one is saying that. The only way your steps could be judged as "a nice piece of work" is with close up shots of welds and fit-up when it is something as basic as that.
    Are you in fact saying that you have no intention of possibly constructing and installing better and more profitable stairs and railings for your customers?

    In post #10 you make it very obvious that you are not even aware of the fact that there are laws about stairways in private homes.

    In post #17 you seem to take the stand just because a company sells kits for stairs it must be ok to make whatever you want and ignore all local laws so anyone who brings up the finer points of the law must just simply be a Know-it-all.

    Read post #21...is he a jerk for pointing out that he got to go back and bring 30 sets of stairs up to code??

    What has anyone said here that makes you think we are saying anything other than you should construct stairs in compliance with local codes?

    Does this post offend you as well?

    Eagerly awaiting your reply...Garry

    www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
    Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
    MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
    Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

    Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
    Miller 30-A Spoolgun
    Miller WC-115-A
    Miller Spectrum 300
    Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
    SPEEDGLAS 9100XX

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Rushville IN
    Posts
    50

    Default handy work

    Lets see some of your handy work. I wonder how the people who build these kits keep their business, i have read alot of your posts and it seems you are a critic of everyone. I have been in this business for 30 years and it the trade for 40. I always make it a point to look for something good in people be it their work, or their beliefs. You must really be a miserable individual, this will be my final post on this. I hope you can find something nice to say to someone, but dont say it to me.....

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    NY
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    103

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    I think that the only point people are trying to get across is that the stair codes are there as a guideline to make things safe for people using them, reduce the liability of the home owner, and the liability of the builder. I don't think anyone that I have ever known wants to create a situation where someone could be permanently injured or die, and that could be the consequence of improperly built stairs. The tight spacing on the verticals is to protect infants from sticking their head through and being strangled, also the kick plate is there to stop a leg or infant from going through, either could be catastrophic.

    To add I think most people come here to learn and get better at what they do, but at times that will mean accepting that you have not looked at things in the proper light. I actually have the most respect for those people that are embarrassingly frank about there blunders, often this is where we all learn the most. I know this is something I can work on, for the rest of my life.

    P.S Thanks to all of you that help all of us in our endeavors here.

    Nick

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