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  1. #41
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hazelwood Mo USA
    Posts
    462

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    I just finished 30 of these pipes, have another 30 to go, it sure would be nice to know the theory of pulse and what to expect with different settings etc....

    I do know that the low pulse rates drive my eyes nuts!! I do know its pretty noisy as well, beyond that I am kind of in the dark ha!!

    A book or an article written on the theory of this would be very nice indeed!

    I have learned that the pulse frequency varies the output some as well, so setting it up I make the changes then hold down the pedal, strike the arc,and look at the ammeter, then make changes to the amp control to keep the same setting.
    Varying the AC frequency also changes the output amps somewhat too, I am refering to the Dynasty 200 DX machine

    It took me a couple of years to get the feel of welding thin gage steel verses stainless, they are similar but have many differences as well.
    Experience is the best teacher but it is the most expensive and takes the most time.....
    mike sr

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hazelwood Mo USA
    Posts
    462

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    One other thing, this forum and the new inverter machine are making me realize how much I dont know!!
    mike sr

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Deltaville, VA
    Posts
    2,239

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    Interesting discussion,

    Over on WW there's a discussion going on about using low PPS rates and transformers, and high PPS and the inverters.

    One thing that thread has pointed out to me is that a lot of people tend to just throw out a bunch of crap (regarding settings) and, I guess, never expect people to try them out or question them.

    As an example, for the last couple weeks, I've had a couple of rather large SS rail jobs on imported trawlers. Melted about 5# of filler (a lot when you're using .045 and 1/16"). Using the Sync I had settled in on a setting around 50A, 2 PPS, 70% Peak, and 30% Background. Up or down a few amps depending on where I was. One things for sure, SS doesn't like a lot of heat.

    Then I read the H.L. Lyons thread. Tried out some settings using the Dynasty 200. This is 7/8", .065 wall SS tubing. 52A, 200 PPS, 70% Peak, 30% Background. You wouldn't believe how much better the weld is.

    Anyway, along comes another poster who's using a transformer with a PPS capable of .01-10 PPS. (The OP who started the thread has an inverter). He recommends a setting of 150A, 30-40% Peak, 2.5 PPS and 20-30 Background. When I questioned him about the 150A he gets all defensive and says that works for him and it's because he's only using 150A 30% of the time.

    Not satisfied with the answer, I set his recommended settings up on my Sync 250. Started at the end of the tube. Dropped the pedal, and, BAM. 1/4" hole in the base metal. Arc force was so strong it blew base metal all the way to the other side of the tube.

    Bottom line. Recommended settings were hogwash. 150A is way too much for .065 stainless, I don't care if it is only on for 30% of the time. I've sent him some recommended setting that WILL work with his machine.

    The whole point in posting this information is that any "recommended" settings should be "validated" by a compentent authority (Miller) before they're published as gospel.
    Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200 DX
    Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
    Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
    Hobart HH187
    Dialarc 250 AC/DC
    Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
    Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
    PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
    Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
    Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
    More grinders than hands

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hazelwood Mo USA
    Posts
    462

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    I welded .065 wall 304 at 48 amps DC, full penetration. This setting is dependent on the machine of course.
    On a slow pulse rate, I could see it blowing a hole in it at 150 amps! Even at a high pulse rate and 30 percent background I think it would still be far too hot.
    Most of the new age dairy welders use the "walking the cup" procedure, it keeps the heat affected area down and makes the weld look nicer as well, I have tried it but its hard to teach an old dog a new trick.
    I am wondering if the pulse can give the same results??

    I read the article mentioned and it is very good, I will have to try it out tomorrow.
    mike sr

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Deltaville, VA
    Posts
    2,239

    Default

    Pop,

    Give these settings a whirl on the Dynasty. Think you'll like them.

    Amps 48-52
    PPS 200
    Peak 70%
    Background 30%

    You won't see the pulsing, but it's there. These settings have worked well for me on the exact material you're working on. You'll need to run pretty fast. Are you backgassing the tubing. If not, you're going to still get a fair amount of sugaring even at those settings.
    Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200 DX
    Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
    Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
    Hobart HH187
    Dialarc 250 AC/DC
    Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
    Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
    PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
    Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
    Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
    More grinders than hands

  6. #46
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    539

    Default

    Ditto on an advanced book with materials listing and starting point settings specifically for inverter machines. Start with the 200dx, gen 1.

    Nothing worse than learning all about a feature or setting, then the reality hits that it's not available in "my" welder.

    Format would be for first chapters to cover features available for the entire "advanced" tig line, followed with machine specific features in the chapters that follow. Be easier to read and follow without the oh crap feeling. Plus, would help clearly define the point the next model up would be needed. Some of the sales folkes are not so good at articulating that information... Would be a valuable sales tool also.

    ---
    Another forum I frequent on a different subject has an "experts only" section. Anyone can post a question, but only the experts can answer.

    Keep in mind these experts are all EE folks, and they actually know what they are talking about...... Pretty level headed and polite folks. They represent the company's products in a profesional light. They are not shy when someone is trying to pull a fast one, clear, profesional, but not shy.

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hazelwood Mo USA
    Posts
    462

    Default

    Thanks Sundown, I will try them.

    I will cut some coupons and give it a try, all our welds were done with back gas or purge on dairy tube. 1" thru 3" was .065, 4 " was heavier wall. I am retired from that the last five years.

    I regularly do the .020 steel stampings now, I will have to post some pics at some point. I have two longitudinal edge seams that need to look nice, thats why all the interest in the pulse at present.

    The article you mentioned previously was very enlightening to me as I had no idea where to start or what to expect.

    I am trying the .020 tungsten again, man is that stuff fragile! My total amps are 14 on this particular weld, the small tungsten will hold a point longer at the low current. Pulse and the small tungsten seems to work better.
    mike sr

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Deltaville, VA
    Posts
    2,239

    Default

    Pops,

    Not sure my eyes are good enough anymore to weld anything that precise.

    I don't think I've even got any .020 tungsten.

    I think you'll like the high PPS pulsing. Much easier on the eyes than slow pulsing. To the eye, it appears to be a constant arc, but the material knows.

    The tubing I'm working with is much smaller diameter, but the same wall thickness. The last rail job I finished up with the Dynasty. All I can say is "WOW", what a difference.
    Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200 DX
    Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
    Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
    Hobart HH187
    Dialarc 250 AC/DC
    Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
    Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
    PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
    Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
    Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
    More grinders than hands

  9. #49
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    323

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by trstek View Post
    Ditto on an advanced book with materials listing and starting point settings specifically for inverter machines. Start with the 200dx, gen 1.
    Let's not forget the Dynasty 300DX..
    Millermatic Passport Plus
    Millermatic 200

    Millermatic 350P with Python
    XMT 304 /w S-64 feeder and 12VS
    Dynasty 300 DX
    Thermal Arc 400 MST
    Victor O/A
    Premier Power Welder for my trail junk.

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hazelwood Mo USA
    Posts
    462

    Default

    The small stainless tube was a bear to weld for me as it gets too hot too quick, I liked the 1 1/2" up to 3". Most all of the tubing I did was fusion welded (sanitary weld), cant think of the word for that now?
    It makes me wonder what it would have been like with the Dynasty type machines, some of the foreign stainless was a bear to get penetration. I liked to use Rath tubing and Ladish fittings (USA made) but that is a thing of the past now as even Ladish fittings are foreign manufactured now.........

    I used angle grinders fitted with the Three M wheels for cleanup, the 2SFN was good for tarnish removal, the 5ACRS was closer to the tubing finish.

    The salt water on those handrails will cause them to surface rust some, we used a nitric acid rinse for tanks to "passivate" them after welding.

    I had a special pair of reading glasses made, 4.0, those are working well for me so far. The steel pipes are a challenge, but they can be done.
    I need a new auto darkening hood that goes to shade eight as light is a big factor as the current goes lower.
    mike sr

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