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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Milan Michigan
    Posts
    1,704

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    Enlpck,

    You are correct, I asked the other person at the other message board to come to our miller site to see what some here would say.

    Unfortunately I could not convince the other person that adding to the flanges verses the webb was a much more common way to reinforce a beam or barjoist and to get the most strength for the amount of steel used.

    Sanora thanks for your illustrations, Thats how I have been doing it for the last 20 years.

    Enlpck,
    You are also correct about hireing an engineer.
    I have always done this off engineered sealed drawings.

    Even when I told the member on the other site that I have been doing so with different engineers over the last 20 years he suggested that my engineers were wrong.

    Hopefully when this other member, Which is also a senior member on this site as well will realize that maybe he was incorrect.

    There is also things such as transfering loads to panel points on bar joists that we had discussed.

    Incertain cases I have also had to run additional diagnal bars into the bar joist after adding to the top & bottom chords.

    Whenever pulling a load off a joist its important to grab from a panel point and if you cant I add an angle from the opposite panel point down or up to where the load is being applied to.

    Vin man, Take a look at Sanoras illustrations, All of those ways are how I have always did the reinforcement on joists and beams.

    If the strength was more about the webb verses the flanges a bar joist would never work.

    When ever you look at truck frames you will typically see holes in the webb and hardly ever in a flange except under certain situations.
    Its also important to always use round or oval holes in beams or truck frames.
    Square holes are very suseptable to tearing in the corners.

    Thanks for the input from all.

    I was also hoping to hear Body baggers formula and calculations.
    Last edited by Portable Welder; 02-25-2009 at 10:24 AM.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,508

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    Quote Originally Posted by Portable Welder View Post
    he suggested that my engineers were wrong.
    Engineers?!!!!!!!!!!!
    We donít need no stinking engineers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    taxachussetts
    Posts
    416

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    I've done some of the other bar joist reinforcing but mostly picture one is the way the Engineers have us do it.
    so what can carry more load in the horizontal position?
    a W-10x14 or a W-12x14 ???
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  4. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    taxachussetts
    Posts
    416

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    OK not a fare question. I'll give a beam that exists.
    I beam 10 x 35, or a 12 x 35 ????
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  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,508

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    All I have is an older book so some of the modern beams arenít in it.

    But a W-12x40 is good for 69,000 @ a 10-foot span.
    A W-10x33 is good for 47,000 @ a 10-foot span.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    16919 Pole Rd. Brethren, MI 49619
    Posts
    4,383

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    I like this if I can do it. http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...0&d=1235520223 Same goes for top.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Lodi, CA
    Posts
    1,270

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    Quote Originally Posted by Portable Welder View Post
    You are also correct about hireing an engineer.
    I have always done this off engineered sealed drawings.
    ?????? I generally work off coffee-shop napkins,,,, just gotta know which coffee shops to go to Of course, it is expected you pick up the tab, also

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,508

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sberry View Post
    I like this if I can do it. http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...0&d=1235520223 Same goes for top.
    I like that one best also. Not to sure about the round stock one! But if an engineer spec it, who am I to argue.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Lake of the Ozarks MO
    Posts
    3,558

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    Quote Originally Posted by JSFAB View Post
    ?????? I generally work off coffee-shop napkins,,,, just gotta know which coffee shops to go to Of course, it is expected you pick up the tab, also
    by far my favorite method

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  10. #30

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    sorry, haven't been here in a while, and don't mean to drag this back up to the top but when it comes to stiffening a simple span beam for load bearing. Adding area - no matter what increases the section modulus thereby increasing it's load bearing capacity. Of course depending on where you add this material can affect it's efficiency. It is important to remember that on a simple span beam (a load bearing beam supported by two fixed end points) that the top flange is always in compression and the bottom is always in tension - this puts the neutral axis at just that - neutral.

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