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Thread: spray welding

  1. #21
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    So if you want to try spraying, you crank up the voltage and change out the bottle? Do you have to switch back to a 75/25 Argon/CO2 mix to go back to regular MIG welding or should you just switch to a 98/2 Argon/Oxygen gas setup for all MIG welding?

    Should you use 98/2 Argon/Oxygen or 90/10 Argon/CO2? I guess I really don't understand the reason behind the different gas mixes and why one is better than the other in certain applications.

    I've always run the typical 75/25 Argon/CO2 gas mix for years, but never tried anything else. I only weld on plain old mild steel.
    Last edited by garybdavis; 07-12-2007 at 07:28 AM.
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  2. #22
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    Thanks James
    Garybdavis, thanks for the questions! Same ones I have also
    Hope to get a response also
    bert
    I'm not late...
    I'm just on Hawaiian Time

  3. #23
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    the book said it needs an argon rich inviorment to acheave true spry. 90% argon with the remainder being a gas which gives special metal transfer charictoristics, such as oxygen or Co2.
    as for doing the rest of your welding with it ??? maybee some of the guys that do spray can chime in. might be a price thing to want to go back to C-25 but i dont know??
    thanks for the help
    ......or..........
    hope i helped

    feel free to shoot me an e-mail direct i have time to chat. james@newyorkmetalart.com
    summer is here, plant a tree. if you don't have space or time to plant one sponsor some one else to plant one for you. a tree is an investment in our planet, help it out.
    JAMES

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by garybdavis View Post
    So if you want to try spraying, you crank up the voltage and change out the bottle? Do you have to switch back to a 75/25 Argon/CO2 mix to go back to regular MIG welding or should you just switch to a 98/2 Argon/Oxygen gas setup for all MIG welding?

    Should you use 98/2 Argon/Oxygen or 90/10 Argon/CO2? I guess I really don't understand the reason behind the different gas mixes and why one is better than the other in certain applications.

    I've always run the typical 75/25 Argon/CO2 gas mix for years, but never tried anything else. I only weld on plain old mild steel.
    Gary, since your unit is a MM 35, stick with the 75/25 you've been using. The MM 35 was designed to be a short circuit transfer unit with COČ or 75/25. It isn't capable of outputting the voltage and amperage needed to be a useful spray arc unit.

    Here's some info you and Bert might find interesting to read. http://www.esabna.com/EUWeb/MIG_handbook/592mig4_1.htm

    BTW, for the page on the ESAB site that I have linked, use the arrows at the bottom of the screen to scroll through the different pages.

    Sorry guys, I own an ESAB Migmaster 250 along with a MM 210, so I visit there website too.

  5. #25
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    Thumbs up so I visit there website too

    Sorry guys, I own an ESAB Migmaster 250 along with a MM 210, so I visit there website too.
    good info is good info no matter where it comes from.
    thanks for the help
    ......or..........
    hope i helped

    feel free to shoot me an e-mail direct i have time to chat. james@newyorkmetalart.com
    summer is here, plant a tree. if you don't have space or time to plant one sponsor some one else to plant one for you. a tree is an investment in our planet, help it out.
    JAMES

  6. #26
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    Danny, James is right ! Long as the info is all good, doesn't matter which company it comes from. I know a weldor that always bought ESAB plasma cutters. Does all kinds of stuff with it he says others won't.
    thanks a lot Danny!!!!!!!
    I'm not late...
    I'm just on Hawaiian Time

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danny View Post
    Gary, since your unit is a MM 35, stick with the 75/25 you've been using. The MM 35 was designed to be a short circuit transfer unit with COČ or 75/25. It isn't capable of outputting the voltage and amperage needed to be a useful spray arc unit.

    Here's some info you and Bert might find interesting to read. http://www.esabna.com/EUWeb/MIG_handbook/592mig4_1.htm

    BTW, for the page on the ESAB site that I have linked, use the arrows at the bottom of the screen to scroll through the different pages.

    Sorry guys, I own an ESAB Migmaster 250 along with a MM 210, so I visit there website too.

    Danny,

    Thanks for the link. Good info. I've been looking for a reason to upgrade to a new, shiny welder.
    Millermatic 35
    Miller TB302G
    Ellis 1800
    Smith & Victor Torches
    Optrel Satellite
    Arcair K4000
    Ingersoll-Rand 175CFM Diesel Air Compressor
    Home Made Welding Trailer

  8. #28
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    Mar 2007
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    ****inson ND
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    Talking

    I always use oxygen instead of co2 for spray unless welding on SS using spray transfer. I generaly try to keep the oxygen content under 10% if possible.

  9. #29
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    near rochester NY
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    I've been looking for a reason to upgrade to a new, shiny welder
    your suposed to have a reason to upgrade.
    dont tell my wife that, you cant beletting that kind of info out on a public forem. you could get a lot of us in truble with the wives with statements like that.
    aaaaaa, shiny and new, good.
    thanks for the help
    ......or..........
    hope i helped

    feel free to shoot me an e-mail direct i have time to chat. james@newyorkmetalart.com
    summer is here, plant a tree. if you don't have space or time to plant one sponsor some one else to plant one for you. a tree is an investment in our planet, help it out.
    JAMES

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Nothern Colorado
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    I just wanted to chime in to clear a couple of things up here. Axial Spray transfer is utilizes higher voltage settings with surface tension to achieve several nice results. As we saw earlier, a really nice bead is one result. Also, greater deposition, deaper-more complete penetration, and faster travel speeds are achieved. Due to these factors, with proper tecnique, a smaller HAZ is created also. As elluded to earlier, a sizable machine is needed to push past the globular transfer into spray transfer, and a change in gas is also needed. Spray transfer does need a very rich argon environment, with a theoretical maximum CO2 content on 18%. I assume this is why I see C18 all the time. 2% oxygen is commonly used as a stabalizer in the sheilding gas, but as this is a reactive gas, the amount must be limited. A tri mix of Argon, Helium, and oxygen is common also in various amounts (90,7.5,2.5 etc...) Cost is a factor to consider though, as CO2 is cheaper than other gases. For most hobby weldors, this is not a concern because of the relatively small amounts of sheilding gas used. For large shops and manufacturers, this can be an area of great study to find the most economical gas or mixture for that partucular application. Due to this, some shops are going straight CO2. Even with the added costs of that gas (splatter and cleanup...) it is cheaper in the long run for them. No spray in that case though.

    Much like spray transfer, pulsed mig uses very high voltage settings. The difference is that the machine cycles between a high voltage and a very low voltage setting. A short circuit method is still used for the actual metal transfer, but with a "cooling" low voltage rest in between. Esentially it is like spot welding 60 or so times a second. This also produces really attractive beads, and a reduced HAZ. Lots of literature is available about pulsed MIG that explains the process very well and every brand says that their's is the best...go figure.

    I've been away for a while and just read this post. Hope this adds some light on this topic.

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