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  • First Time

    My new welder should be arriving today (Millermatic 180) and I've got a few questions...

    I'll be practicing on some square tubing to get started, but my first real project will be on a trailer I picked up a few weeks ago. The trailer is a Canadian M101 - much like the Bantam and the M416. I plan on cutting in a tail gate and adding some support, and my question is what type of shielding gas and wire should I be using for this kind of work? I used the Welding Calculator and came up with CO2 and .035 ER70S-3 (or ER70S-6)... Does this sound right?

    Thanks

  • #2
    Originally posted by DevEmp View Post
    My new welder should be arriving today (Millermatic 180) and I've got a few questions...

    I'll be practicing on some square tubing to get started, but my first real project will be on a trailer I picked up a few weeks ago. The trailer is a Canadian M101 - much like the Bantam and the M416. I plan on cutting in a tail gate and adding some support, and my question is what type of shielding gas and wire should I be using for this kind of work? I used the Welding Calculator and came up with CO2 and .035 ER70S-3 (or ER70S-6)... Does this sound right?

    Thanks
    You can use C02 and ER70S-6 ok but you might be happier with C25 gas. CO2 will get you some better pennitration but with some splatter you won't find with C25. Bottom line is some like CO2 and some like C25, for me it's C25 always and if I need more pennitration then I will use fluxcore wire and no gas. Oh yeah one more thing, CO2 is most likely going to be cheaper to buy and will last longer.
    Regards, George

    Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
    Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
    Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

    Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
    Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Sundown View Post
      You can use C02 and ER70S-6 ok but you might be happier with C25 gas.
      I got the welder unboxed and all ready to go. Tomorrow I'll be slapping a breaker in and installing a recep (anyone here put a different cord end on their welder to work on the 4 wire receps VS the 3 wire cord end it comes with?) and if there's time - heading over to Airgas to pick up a tank of C25. Spoke with a friend at work, and he uses the same thing, so I'll give it a shot. Also, the welder came with a roll of ER70S-6...

      The Fedex driver wasn't too happy carrying the box to my door, and after lifting it on to the counter, I can see why. Makes me think I should have picked up the cart to go with it. I guess that will have to be one of the first projects. I'd ask for directions to a set a drawings for one, but I think I've seen the answer to be "just build one".

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DevEmp View Post
        ...
        Tomorrow I'll be slapping a breaker in and installing a recep (anyone here put a different cord end on their welder to work on the 4 wire receps VS the 3 wire cord end it comes with?)
        ...
        If you have to install a new receptacle, why not just use the proper NEMA 6-50R receptacle that matches the NEMA 6-50P plug that already exists on the power cord of the MM180.

        When I ran the circuit for my Thunderbolt XL and Millermatic 180, I picked up a 6-50R from the local Home Depot. They don't give them away, but it was cheaper than buying the "wrong" receptacle in addition to the "wrong" plug to match it.
        Tom Veatch
        Wichita, KS

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        • #5
          Originally posted by TomVeatch View Post
          If you have to install a new receptacle, why not just use the proper NEMA 6-50R receptacle that matches the NEMA 6-50P plug that already exists on the power cord of the MM180.

          When I ran the circuit for my Thunderbolt XL and Millermatic 180, I picked up a 6-50R from the local Home Depot. They don't give them away, but it was cheaper than buying the "wrong" receptacle in addition to the "wrong" plug to match it.
          I didn't mean wrong as in say a 20 amp 125 volt cord end and recep, I meant more along the lines of changing the cord end to a twist lock and making it so it can be used in a 4 wire recep instead of 3 wire (which is being phased out here). By wrong I guess I meant over kill and not redneck engineering... I'm also looking for a weather proof assembly as I have to mount a recep under my electrical panel and run a 50' 50 amp SO cord to the welder.

          Comment


          • #6
            If you are going to use a 4-wire (2 hots, neutral, and ground) plug and receptacle, on the plug (welder) side, just leave the neutral blade unconnected - you won't have a neutral wire anyway. On the receptacle side, connect as normal, hot wires to the hot contacts, neutral to the neutral contact, and ground to the ground contact. If you're not sure which is which, look here.
            Tom Veatch
            Wichita, KS

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            • #7
              Congtrats on the new welder DevEmp. I just bought my Millermatic 180 yesterday. I need to wire it then I'll be giving it a try. When I first bought it, I thought I would be able to tap into my 30 amp dryer outlet but I guess not. Good luck with yours.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by acsuppa View Post
                Congtrats on the new welder DevEmp. I just bought my Millermatic 180 yesterday. I need to wire it then I'll be giving it a try. When I first bought it, I thought I would be able to tap into my 30 amp dryer outlet but I guess not. Good luck with yours.
                Don't see any reason why you can't use the dryer outlet, lots of guys and gals do, just make a short pigtail so that both ends work as they are.
                Regards, George

                Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
                Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
                Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

                Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
                Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

                Comment


                • #9
                  I ended up mounting a 2 gang bell box at my panel and I stuck the 6-50R recep in it for now. I picked up a roll of flux core and just had to test the welder - it worked. I managed to take a bunch of old unistrut that was laying around and make it all one piece. Next I'm going to pick up the same stuff for my first few projects (seems like the cart is always in the top 3) and practice with that - mainly square tubing. It's too bad the area of the house where the panel is located is the worst place for me to do any welding. Now I'm trying to find a decent cord (free to cheap) so I can do the work in the back yard and on concrete.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DevEmp View Post
                    ...I meant more along the lines of changing the cord end to a twist lock and making it so it can be used in a 4 wire recep instead of 3 wire (which is being phased out here). ...
                    I don't know what you mean by being phased out. The NEMA 6-50 grounding 240V hardware is industry standard for welding machines and other 50A 240V machinery. Were you perhaps referring to old 120/240V non-grounding NEMA 10-30 and NEMA 10-50 hardware that old dryers and ranges used? If so, yes, those have been replaced with 4-wire grounding hardware. Either can be adapted to a NEMA 6-50 for use with your machine.

                    If you are installing a receptacle to be dedicated to the welding machine, then make the NEMA 6-50 hardware the permanent set-up. Looks like you got a handle on it, but I'll be back in Las Vegas for a few days in May if you want some help. Otherwise, I'm in Mexico until at least August.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by MAC702 View Post
                      I don't know what you mean by being phased out. The NEMA 6-50 grounding 240V hardware is industry standard for welding machines and other 50A 240V machinery.
                      I'm speaking more in terms of the construciton electircal industry in Las Vegas and not the welding side of it. From my last conversation with an electrical inspector some time last fall, they were looking to see neutrals pulled to just about every location... Depending on the contractor, all of the temp power is NEMA twist lock (I can only think of one of the larger union shops that still uses household receps on their 20 amp temp power), and all of the spider boxes are 3 phase 5 wire. My background as an electrician gets in the way of my welding inexperience...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DevEmp View Post
                        I'm speaking more in terms of the construciton electircal industry in Las Vegas and not the welding side of it. From my last conversation with an electrical inspector some time last fall, they were looking to see neutrals pulled to just about every location... Depending on the contractor, all of the temp power is NEMA twist lock (I can only think of one of the larger union shops that still uses household receps on their 20 amp temp power), and all of the spider boxes are 3 phase 5 wire. My background as an electrician gets in the way of my welding inexperience...
                        News to me. My wife is an IBEW union journeyman in Las Vegas, and I used to be. I'm independent now. I see dedicated 240V loads in new commercial and industrial installations all the time. There is absolutely no need for a neutral to these locations, and no inspector has ever told me otherwise. I did have to teach one about Article 630, though.

                        Temp power for construction is a whole different deal. As for union contractors, Bombard is the biggest in town, followed by Mojave. Apex is up there now, too. My wife and I have both worked for all three. She's also worked for Sturgeon, if you remember when they were doing inside work.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I worked at Dyna when it was still a decent player in town... as for the neutral request, I can't remember if it came from Parkhouse or Salem. It was some time last year, probably near the time they began phasing in the 2005 NEC. I can understand some of the reasoning about pulling a neutral to something wanting 240V, but I'm not sure if it's just equipment manufacturers covering their ***, electrical engineers looking at worst case what if's, or if there really is some merit to it. All I know is that I go by what's on the drawings unless it's blatantly wrong.

                          As far as being in the union goes, you and I both know this welder will never be riding to work with me.

                          Originally posted by MAC702 View Post
                          News to me. My wife is an IBEW union journeyman in Las Vegas, and I used to be. I'm independent now. I see dedicated 240V loads in new commercial and industrial installations all the time. There is absolutely no need for a neutral to these locations, and no inspector has ever told me otherwise. I did have to teach one about Article 630, though.

                          Temp power for construction is a whole different deal. As for union contractors, Bombard is the biggest in town, followed by Mojave. Apex is up there now, too. My wife and I have both worked for all three. She's also worked for Sturgeon, if you remember when they were doing inside work.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Sundown, I see that a lot of people do use the 30 amp dryer outlet but I thought it woyuld be safer to use the "appropriate" sized wire for the job. I do under stand that my welder will draw no were near 50 amps. I actuallyu picked up the breaker and 6-50R plug this weekend and wired it up. For the piece of mind it gives me, it was worth the extra effort and a few bucks. Thanks.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              M101 Trailer

                              Originally posted by DevEmp View Post
                              My new welder should be arriving today (Millermatic 180) and I've got a few questions...

                              I'll be practicing on some square tubing to get started, but my first real project will be on a trailer I picked up a few weeks ago. The trailer is a Canadian M101 - much like the Bantam and the M416. I plan on cutting in a tail gate and adding some support, and my question is what type of shielding gas and wire should I be using for this kind of work? I used the Welding Calculator and came up with CO2 and .035 ER70S-3 (or ER70S-6)... Does this sound right?

                              Thanks
                              Hey DevEmp,
                              Let's see a pic of your M101 trailer.
                              Gregg

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