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  • #16
    DR,

    While the thoriated "can" be used for most applications, I've personally found it not to be the "best".

    With both the Syncrowave 250 and the Dynasty 200 DX, I've sorta settled on two tungstens. The thoriated for steel/SS, and the 2% lanthanated for aluminum. That's what I use on both machines.

    The problem I found with AC welding with the thoriated is that as the amps go up, the tungsten tends to "split" and form multiple small "ba11s" on the tip. Once this occurs, it's time to hit the grinder because the arc starts to wander.

    The 2% lanthanated, under higher amps, will tend to form a single smaller, controllable ba11 at the tip. This is more prevelant with the Sync than it is with the Dynasty. All said thought, I find the lanthanated to produce a much more controlled arc than the pure.

    I suspect the whole issue (pure vs lanthanated/ceriated) dates back to when the manuals were written for the Syncrowave machines (about 1975). At that time thoriated and pure were the most common tungstens available. Consequently, they recommended thoriated for steel and pure for aluminum.

    Interesting to note that Miller specifically recommends NOT using pure tungsten in their inverter machines.

    While I've still got a considerable "stockpile" of pure tungsten left over from the "old days", I can't remember when I last stuck one in a tig torch. I have found a variety of uses for them though (scribes, chopsticks, axles for wooden toys, etc, etc). If anyone else has some suggestions I'd be glad to hear them.

    Off the soapbox. Didn't really mean to jump back on but when I see "experts" expounding BS without having a clue what they're talking about, I do tend to get my feathers ruffled. It should be clear to anyone reading this thread who I'm talking about.
    Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200 DX
    Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
    Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
    Hobart HH187
    Dialarc 250 AC/DC
    Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
    Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
    PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
    Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
    Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
    More grinders than hands

    Comment


    • #17
      Glad you jumped back on. I've still got a few pure tungstens from when i had a sync. Now That i have an inverter I'm in the same boat. I never thought about using them as scribes. I'd bet they would fit in an architect's lead holder and could be used like a pencil and clipped in a pocket when not in use.
      Sometimes there's no second chances.

      Comment


      • #18
        Sundown, I agree the red I use is far from the best for everything, especially AC. I've found the same thing about the thoriated splitting and spitting under higher amps on AC.
        Millermatic350P/Python, MillermaticReach/Q300
        Millermatic175
        MillermaticPassport/Q300
        HTP MIG200
        PowCon 300SM, MK Cobramatic
        ThermalArc 185ACDC, Dynaflux Tig'r, CK-20
        DialarcHF, Radiator-1
        Hypertherm PowerMax 380
        Purox oxy/ace
        Jackson EQC
        -F350 CrewCab 4x4
        -LoadNGo utility bed
        -Bobcat 250NT
        -PassportPlus/Q300
        -XMT304/Optima/Spoolmatic15A
        -Suitcase8RC/Q400
        -Suitcase12RC/Q300
        -Smith oxy/propane
        -Jackson EQC

        Comment


        • #19
          Just a quick note as I am very busy lately.
          The people who like what pure produces on a syncrowave, would be very happy with BROWN IMO. (on AC)
          Sorry I hated to throw another color in there
          As for People who like to use pure on a Dynasty I wish they would say what mode the machine was in. If they know how to tell.
          I feel pure is totally useless and am 100% with Sundown on this.
          If you use pure tungsten on an ADVANCED square wave machine (and in that mode) then you are probably running bias ply tires on your car as well.

          www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
          Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
          MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
          Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
          Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

          Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
          Miller 30-A Spoolgun
          Miller WC-115-A
          Miller Spectrum 300
          Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
          Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

          Comment


          • #20
            LMAO @ bias ply tires..... wow..... anyway, i have a synchro and i use pure tungsten. i like the way it welds. i have not tried the brown bands, i will give them a try, but not making any promises.... (most of my tig work is on aluminum)
            welder_one

            nothing fancy, just a few hot glue guns for metal
            www.sicfabrications.com

            Comment


            • #21
              Welder_One,

              Took me awhile to make the transition also but once I got comfortable with the 2% Lanthanated, I'd never go back to green.

              Heck, when you use a product for 20+ years (green), it's like finally throwing away an old pair of boots to make a change.
              Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
              Dynasty 200 DX
              Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
              Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
              Hobart HH187
              Dialarc 250 AC/DC
              Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
              Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
              PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
              Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
              Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
              More grinders than hands

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by welder_one View Post
                LMAO @ bias ply tires..... wow..... anyway, i have a synchro and i use pure tungsten. i like the way it welds. i have not tried the brown bands, i will give them a try, but not making any promises.... (most of my tig work is on aluminum)
                I'm still using an old transformer and more and more have been using brown and orange for AC on aluminum. The brown works better on dirty sheet aluminum than the green ever did and the orange works best on dirty cast aluminum.

                One of the biggest problems in my area is it seems all the welding suppliers stock are red & green tungsten. I've had to order all of my Zirconiated and Ceriated tungstens. I guess I'll be all set when I do finally bite the bullet and get an inverter machine.

                Go ahead and try the browns (and no not the ones in Cleveland who can't beat anyone) you'll be glad you did!
                Blondie (Owner C & S Automotive)

                Colt the original point & click interface!

                Millermatic 35 with spot panel
                Miller 340A/BP
                Victor O/A torches
                Lincoln SP125
                Too many other tools to list

                03 Ram 1500
                78 GS1000
                82 GL1100 Interstate

                Comment


                • #23
                  next week, i have a little job that i am doing for a sign shop... it is aluminum, and i called in the order for "brown" tungsten today, so they should be on my door step in the a.m. (my lws delivers to my house...lol...) i will let ya'll know how that goes!
                  welder_one

                  nothing fancy, just a few hot glue guns for metal
                  www.sicfabrications.com

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Sundown

                    Green tungsten can be used on "barby q" for kabobs you can tell your guest pure tungsten no contaminates green end for veggie vegans.

                    "Change is good donkey"

                    Ronnie

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      this is just silly,,, green works great, the trick to using green,,, is knowing how to weld....

                      and like i said a few posts up,, it still has its place in the welding world today, or at least in my world.

                      pure produces some of the nicest, roundest stacked dimes

                      not this "V" pointed inverter crap,,, LOL

                      like this
                      ))))))))))))

                      not this
                      >>>>>>>
                      Anything you could do, I could do better.
                      I can do anything better than you!
                      Lockheed Martin
                      Armco Steel, Baltimore
                      USW local #3185

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Well, maybe you'd like to give me some instruction on tig welding.

                        After all, I've only been tig (Heli-arc) welding aluminum since 1966.

                        Course, I guess if you're still striking an arc with an antique sine wave machine without a balance control, you should still be using pure, although the zirconiated (brown) will carry more amps and maintain the ba11 better.

                        The guys who "know" how to tig weld and have kept up with the times know differently.
                        Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                        Dynasty 200 DX
                        Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                        Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                        Hobart HH187
                        Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                        Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                        Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                        PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                        Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                        Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                        More grinders than hands

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          i drive a 1970 pickup, daily, people keep telling me to buy a new one, they are better.

                          but i say they are wrong.


                          in my original post i stated

                          "on my sync 200


                          i use thoriated for steel

                          i use lanthanated for most aluminum

                          i use pure when i want more of a rounded wider dime stack on thicker aluminum. "



                          and i stand by those remarks,, its more of my preference i suppose
                          Last edited by stugots; 06-26-2010, 02:16 PM.
                          Anything you could do, I could do better.
                          I can do anything better than you!
                          Lockheed Martin
                          Armco Steel, Baltimore
                          USW local #3185

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Yea,

                            I bought my first Corvette (a 62 with both tops) back in 1963. Thought that car was "hot sh1t". In reality it was in 1963.

                            I'm also not stupid enough to think that it was a better Vette than a 2009 Z06.
                            Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                            Dynasty 200 DX
                            Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                            Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                            Hobart HH187
                            Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                            Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                            Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                            PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                            Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                            Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                            More grinders than hands

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by SundownIII View Post
                              Well, maybe you'd like to give me some instruction on tig welding.

                              After all, I've only been tig (Heli-arc) welding aluminum since 1966.

                              Course, I guess if you're still striking an arc with an antique sine wave machine without a balance control, you should still be using pure, although the zirconiated (brown) will carry more amps and maintain the ba11 better.

                              The guys who "know" how to tig weld and have kept up with the times know differently.
                              Keep in mind the one saying this crap to you brags about doing stuff I doubt he even has the baIIs to do.

                              Whatever.....
                              So you're telling me...You're not nostalgic? Then, give me another word for it......

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I still use green tungsten on my good ol blue transformer as well as the orange and brown tungsten. It all depends on what I'm working on. My main use for the green tungsten is on ****** aluminum, but I can't remember the last time I welded on new aluminum. Most of my aluminum welding is on aluminum that has been through all kinds of crap and is dirty and contaminated. So each tungsten has it's place. I know that the inverters call for ceriated tungsten which I have an ample supply of now as well as the green and brown that I'll still use on the ol blue sherman tank.
                                Blondie (Owner C & S Automotive)

                                Colt the original point & click interface!

                                Millermatic 35 with spot panel
                                Miller 340A/BP
                                Victor O/A torches
                                Lincoln SP125
                                Too many other tools to list

                                03 Ram 1500
                                78 GS1000
                                82 GL1100 Interstate

                                Comment

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