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  • HH and MM

    I'm relatively new to welding and to this site. There is a lot of writing on this site about hh vs mm. Since they are the same company, what is the essential difference between the two that makes one "better" than the other if comparing the same size machine? Is it personal preference, price, or does one in fact do a better job?

  • #2
    In a nutshell, Hobarts are more for hobbyist/home use and Miller is more for industrial/commercial use.


    Miller also has a much larger selection of equipment.

    Also, saying a Hobart is the same as a Miller is like saying a Chevy Cavalier is just as good as a Cadillac. (same parent company - very different products)

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    • #3
      very well put, ts. one is a comercial quality and one is homeowner quality
      welder_one

      nothing fancy, just a few hot glue guns for metal
      www.sicfabrications.com

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      • #4
        That is untill you start talking about portable migs...right now the HH210 is ruling the planet.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
          That is untill you start talking about portable migs...right now the HH210 is ruling the planet.
          Huh??

          It's rated at only 15 more amps than the MM180

          The HH210 is all plastic and missing several features of the MM180
          Last edited by TS-Off-Road; 11-11-2007, 05:34 PM.

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          • #6
            mm and hh

            Thanks. That's very valuable information guys.
            I'm really starting to feel that the MM180 just may be the right machine to get me started, even though of course I would want more and bigger just for that unknown eventuality when I might need more and bigger. But do I now?

            I have a half ton truck that has been absolutely great for me since '02. Now I'm pulling a 50HP tractor and my truck doesn't like it's new job. That half ton has been completely satisfying and did everything I asked it to until now, and from '02 until now a one ton would have contained a lot of unused truck at a significant initial cost - if that makes any sense. Now all of a sudden the application dictates that I use a stronger truck.

            I'm going to use that same (and true) analogy for my first welding machine purchase. Let me get what my budget permits and something that will also satisfy my known needs. Once (and if ever) it doesn't like its new job, I'll just have to buy it a big brother (or sister).

            This is a terrific message board.

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            • #7
              Tonyrico,

              Understand where you're coming from regarding the right machine for what you need "now".

              I'd suggest that you go to the Hobart board and review posting on the HH187 and HH210. One of the most knowledgeable Migger's there, DAN, has used both the HH187 and MM180 (owns a HH187). Think the concensus is that the HH187 is a better performing mig than the MM180. The HH210 is a new machine, but uses the same design as the HH187, and has been received very well. It is also spoolgun ready without additional controllers. They're going for about $850 via the internet (Cyberweld.com).

              I have a HH187, as well as a Miller 251, and, within it's range, it welds better than the Miller.

              The comment about the Hobart being "all plastic" is pure BS and must come from a poster who's never physically touched a HH187. Hobart (who's parent company is the same as Miller) is great in the customer service dept.

              Just my .02.
              Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
              Dynasty 200 DX
              Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
              Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
              Hobart HH187
              Dialarc 250 AC/DC
              Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
              Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
              PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
              Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
              Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
              More grinders than hands

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              • #8
                Originally posted by TS-Off-Road View Post
                Huh??

                It's rated at only 15 more amps than the MM180

                The HH210 is all plastic and missing several features of the MM180
                I get 30A more out of the HH210 with my math. But I don't own a MM180. I have owned a MM175 and currently own a HH210.

                But back on question, the smaller units are very similar, except for tapped v. continuously adjustable voltages, which on current models are not a problem. The 210 and 250A units have a big edge with the Millers in features.

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                • #9
                  MAC702,

                  I was referring to the rated output, which may or may not matter, depending on how it is used.

                  HH210 150A @ 30%
                  MM180 135A @ 30%

                  You mentioned a couple of the other differences.


                  SundownIII,

                  I won't resort to calling your post "BS", as you are entitled to your opinion, as everyone is.

                  I looked at the Hobarts and didn't care for the "rugged plastic" as they call it, in place of some of the metal parts on the Miller.

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                  • #10
                    Well, I don't know what to tell ya...my HH210 has been in an industrial enviroment for over a year now and is holding up just fine. I am quite sure it will kick the crap out of a MM180 on aluminum......quite sure.
                    Don


                    '06 Trailblazer 302
                    '06 12RC feeder
                    Super S-32P feeder

                    HH210 & DP3035 spool gun
                    Esab Multimaster 260
                    Esab Heliarc 252 AC/DC

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                    • #11
                      TS-Off-Road,

                      I took exception with your comment about the Hobart's being "all" plastic. I do not own a HH210 nor have I welded with one, however, I do own a HH187 and the case is metal, the door is metal, the drive rollers are metal, and on and on. The front of the machine is a high impact plastic (similar to the dashboard on your car, I suspect) but it is in no way "cheaply made".

                      If you have not welded with a Hobart machine (187,210) I would suggest that you reserve judgement on their capabilities. I have both a Miller and a Hobart mig, and as I stated previously, within it's capabilities, I prefer the Hobart over the Miller.

                      A resident expert on Mig's (mig welds daily, photos of his work are posted) is a poster named Dan on the Hobart boards. Read his evaluations on the HH187 and the MM180. You'll find that he ranks the HH187 tops in the 180A mig range.

                      Sorry you don't like plastic. That's your choice. I guess you wouldn't like the Miller MM251 either since the front panel is molded plastic, just as the Hobart.

                      I also think it an unfair assessment to call the Hobart a hobby machine and the Miller a professional machine. Check out the warranty for both. Interestingly, both (HH187, MM180) both use the M10 gun, which is the most abused piece of equipment on any mig machine.

                      Just my .02.
                      Last edited by SundownIII; 11-12-2007, 12:18 AM.
                      Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                      Dynasty 200 DX
                      Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                      Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                      Hobart HH187
                      Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                      Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                      Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                      PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                      Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                      Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                      More grinders than hands

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Now kids!

                        I in no way want to pick on one's welder, one's ego or anything else for that matter. So please take this with whatever salt you can. I don't have a Hobart, never did and perhaps never will. To much negative info out there within the pro-community to get me interested. True or false it's there! Maybe kinda like when the news wants you to believe what they are peddling so they just keep rehashing it to the point you feel "it must be true". With that said and holding on the 26 years of mig'n, I'll stick with my Millers thank you.

                        No harm, no insult or otherwise intended to you Hobart guys!

                        TacMig
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by TS-Off-Road View Post
                          ...I was referring to the rated output, ...
                          HH210 150A @ 30%
                          MM180 135A @ 30%...
                          I thought you might be, but that's just for rating purposes. We really need to go by what the machine's output at their top end. And that 30A at the top end puts the HH210 in a whole different class of machine, even if we don't look at the much easier spoolgun hookup.

                          That 30A especially makes a difference if you're thinking about welding aluminum, and it also allows the machine to break into spray arc with the right gas.

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                          • #14
                            Series 100 spoolgun

                            Mac702, having just bought my MM180, I was pleased to see the hangtag (and later, the product blurb on Miller site) about the direct connect Series 100 spoolgun for the 180. Unless I'm missing something, it looks like a great option for aluminum welding.

                            I'm new here. Been wanting a big-little MM for a couple of years. Have taken a class, but am still a total amateur.

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                            • #15
                              well here is my Opinion (may differ from y`all`s but it is mine) I have welded with the hh 180 and a mm180 I think they are both great machines . So i think I would buy which one I could buy cheapest for hobby(home) use.
                              but remeber thats my opinion on it

                              Inferno Forge

                              Chris

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