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  • help...dump trailer!

    dont know anything about trailers, but have been offered a project to convert a 16' tandem into a dump trailer. dont know how or where to start. any advice...........how much $$?, how difficult?,any inspection required?.......the more info you could give me the better thx

  • #2
    Not worth it.

    Originally posted by enwhy View Post
    dont know anything about trailers, but have been offered a project to convert a 16' tandem into a dump trailer. dont know how or where to start. any advice...........how much $$?, how difficult?,any inspection required?.......the more info you could give me the better thx
    I have found out 90% of the time it is not worth it. First how is the frame and what is the material it is made out of.? You will have to make a subframe with sides and tail gate. Sit that sub frame on top of trailer. install a dump cly. unit as well as a hyd. power pack, and a battery . Plus most trailer frames are too close to the ground all dump trailers the axle springs are over slung with longer hangers. this adds ground clearance. In my opinion it's better to buy a dump trailer than to try to make one out of a flat bed. Or make one from scratch, but you can buy cheaper than making one. I know I have priced them out vs the material and parts.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by enwhy View Post
      dont know anything about trailers, but have been offered a project to convert a 16' tandem into a dump trailer. dont know how or where to start. any advice...........how much $$?, how difficult?,any inspection required?.......the more info you could give me the better thx
      Here we go again..........................

      Before any of your questions can be answered you need to give us A LOT MORE INFORMATION

      First things first,


      what is your experience level?
      what type of tools and equipment are at your disposal?
      what process are you going to weld with?
      what is the rating on the trailer?
      what materials were used in the trailer frame?
      etc.....etc.....etc.....etc.....

      After you give us the much needed answers to these questions, I will give you some much needed advice as to why it probably should not be done, besides the obvious cost factors mentioned by urch55
      If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

      sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
      Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

      Comment


      • #4
        Yepper,

        Second, I want to build/modify a trailer post of the week. This one's really cool though. He asks that the respondent provide "as much information as possible", yet he chooses to provide absolutely none (except stating he knows nothing about trailers).


        Dave,

        Ever thought of writing a book and selling it to these guys?
        Last edited by SundownIII; 07-27-2009, 07:16 PM.
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        • #5
          Enwhy.

          Another thing to consider, Contact your state for laws pertaining to trailers.
          The state of Florida has a law if the empty weight of a trailer is 2000 pounds or more it has to be inspected and a title will be issued. And with all that iron on that trailer it's a safe bet it will be over 2000 lbs.

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          • #6
            Does it currently have brakes? If not and the GVRW exceeds 2900# (at least in AZ) it will have to have brakes. What's the rating of the current axles? 5,6 or 8 bolt? What GVWR are you after? Do you want to be able to dump a trailer load of duck feathers or a trailer load of rock, dirt and gravel?
            Miller Syncrowave 200
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            • #7
              Originally posted by urch55 View Post
              Enwhy.

              Another thing to consider, Contact your state for laws pertaining to trailers.
              The state of Florida has a law if the empty weight of a trailer is 2000 pounds or more it has to be inspected and a title will be issued. And with all that iron on that trailer it's a safe bet it will be over 2000 lbs.
              urch, I beg to differ with you, I have personally built over 700 trailers and sold everyone of them with only a certificate of origin, which I might add is nothing more than a document that I draw up on company stationary. They want nothing more than to see the empty weight, the max payload and that I certify that it was manufactured in the U.S.A.. The parts however can come from anywhere, it just has to be assembled in the States. The only other thing required by Federal law is that I certify any single axle over 3500 pounds to have brakes, and that all tandems regardless of weight or payload have brakes with a break a way kit supplied. Does not have to work, just has to be there. Federal law also mandates that all lighting be D.O.T. approved and now they are requiring conspicuity tape to be placed down the sides of the trailers.

              Registration differs from county to county, some counties specify that I collect all sales taxes and others specify that they are to collect them. Some counties require that I supply a 17 digit v.i.n. and others assign the numbers themselves.

              I have never had a single trailer go through any form of an inspection process. As far as a title goes, you have to specifically ask the clerk at the D.M.V. for one, a trailer needs only a bill of sale and registration papers to be legal, these are some of the very reasons that you see so many hobbled up homemade pieces of cr@p on the road today. If Florida did mandate an inspection process I would have to guess close to half of the trailers in use today would fail.
              If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

              sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
              Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

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              • #8
                my mistake

                sorry for the lack of info, first timer to the site.......as far as my experience i've only been welding for about 6 years. I'm a registered B welder. Have lots of experience with structural, some pressure/pipe,valve and actuator assemblies, etc etc. However, i've got little to no mechanical background. This trailer project was just offered a day ago, so perhaps my request for help was no doubt premature. Heres what i do know.........the frame is
                4x4hss, cross members are channel, the decking is wood 2x6, and it's rated at 14,000lbs. As far as the weld process.....micro wire probably.

                hopefully ill be able to aquire a little more info to post by tommorrow after i go meet with the guy........thx for the advice so far tho

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by SundownIII View Post
                  Yepper,

                  Second, I want to build/modify a trailer post of the week. This one's really cool though. He asks that the respondent provide "as much information as possible", yet he chooses to provide absolutely none (except stating he knows nothing about trailers).


                  Dave,

                  Ever thought of writing a book and selling it to these guys?




                  Nah, wouldn't do any good, they're all smarter than the guy that does this for a living.
                  If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

                  sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
                  Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by dabar39 View Post
                    urch, I beg to differ with you, I have personally built over 700 trailers and sold everyone of them with only a certificate of origin, which I might add is nothing more than a document that I draw up on company stationary. They want nothing more than to see the empty weight, the max payload and that I certify that it was manufactured in the U.S.A.. The parts however can come from anywhere, it just has to be assembled in the States. The only other thing required by Federal law is that I certify any single axle over 3500 pounds to have brakes, and that all tandems regardless of weight or payload have brakes with a break a way kit supplied. Does not have to work, just has to be there. Federal law also mandates that all lighting be D.O.T. approved and now they are requiring conspicuity tape to be placed down the sides of the trailers.

                    Registration differs from county to county, some counties specify that I collect all sales taxes and others specify that they are to collect them. Some counties require that I supply a 17 digit v.i.n. and others assign the numbers themselves.

                    I have never had a single trailer go through any form of an inspection process. As far as a title goes, you have to specifically ask the clerk at the D.M.V. for one, a trailer needs only a bill of sale and registration papers to be legal, these are some of the very reasons that you see so many hobbled up homemade pieces of cr@p on the road today. If Florida did mandate an inspection process I would have to guess close to half of the trailers in use today would fail.
                    Back in 1990 I built a tandem axle trailer. It weighed 2020 lbs. The person at the tag office said I would have to schedule an inspection and a title will be issued because it weighed more than 2000 lbs. Now are you telling me that the State changed the law.?? But I will tell you this there may be a differance between a trailer listed as Home made or ASPT. And one that is listed as being manufactured.. What do you think.??

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by urch55 View Post
                      Back in 1990 I built a tandem axle trailer. It weighed 2020 lbs. The person at the tag office said I would have to schedule an inspection and a title will be issued because it weighed more than 2000 lbs. Now are you telling me that the State changed the law.?? But I will tell you this there may be a differance between a trailer listed as Home made or ASPT. And one that is listed as being manufactured.. What do you think.??
                      I wasn't in the trailer business back in 1990 so I can't say how it was done then, only the procedures I go through now as stated above. As far as homemade trailers go, all you have to do is take the receipts with you for the products used in the build (to be sure nothing is stolen) and a print out of the weight from a certified scale operator, that could be at any truck stop, county land fill or salvage yard with certified scales. The D.M.V. office is only interested in one thing, a check payable to them.
                      If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

                      sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
                      Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Yes I know how to get a trailer tag that's no problem. I just looked at the state web site. It says trailers under 1999 lbs. no titles are required.. Ask one of your customers that bought a trailer from you that weighed over 2000lbs. if when they went to the tag office if they were issued a title. http://www.flhsmv.gov/dmv/faqtitle.html
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by urch55; 07-27-2009, 09:48 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by urch55 View Post
                          Yes I know how to get a trailer tag that's no problem. I just looked at the state web site. It says trailers under 1999 lbs. no titles are requiredhttp://www.flhsmv.gov/dmv/faqtitle.html
                          Trailers under 1999 lbs. are considered personal use type of trailer so no there is no title, 2000 and over is considered a commercial use trailer and they do get a title issued to them. We are not talking about commercial duty trailers here, and I'm not sure if you realize their classifications. One of my basic 5'X10' trailers weighs in at about 480 lbs. (but has a 3500 max. payload)depending on the options and a 6'4"X16'(7000lb. max payload) weighs in at 860lbs., so as you can clearly see, no title. When they say a 1999 lb. or less trailer you are talking about trailers in the 10,000lb or less payloads. A trailer weighing in at over 2000 lbs. is gonna be rated to carry up to a 26,000 payload (depending of course the type of brakes used, air brakes or air assist is listed differently altogether) Then we also could go into the specifics of semi trailers but that would open up a whole nuther rule book.

                          Another small tidbit of information, Many of the local Municipalities view any single axle utility type trailer as being personal use and tandem axle utility type trailers are considered commercial use even though they are not registered as such, thereby making it illegal to keep a tandem trailer on personal property, not very widely enforced by the code enforcement officers, but many of the small towns have the law in their books.

                          I can't save the page from D.M.V., but this is a cut copy and paste from page two of their title application

                          WHO IS AUTHORIZED TO COMPLETE THIS FORM?
                          ANY PERSON OR AUTHORIZED AGENT OF ANY PERSON, REQUIRED TO MAKE APPLICATION
                          FOR CERTIFICATE OF TITLE AND/OR REGISTRATION.
                          WHEN SHOULD THIS FORM BE COMPLETED?
                          ON ALL USED MOTOR VEHICLES, INCLUDING TRAILERS NOT CURRENTLY TITLED IN FLORIDA,
                          WITH A NET WEIGHT OF 2,000 POUNDS OR MORE.
                          WHEN SHOULD THIS FORM NOT BE COMPLETED?
                          WHEN CERTIFICATE OF TITLE IS BEING APPLIED FOR ON ONE OF THE FOLLOWING:
                          1. NEW MOTOR VEHICLE, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER PURCHASED IN FLORIDA OR
                          OUT-OF-STATE
                          2. MOBILE HOME
                          3. TRAILER OR SEMITRAILER WITH A NET WEIGHT OF LESS THAN 2,000 POUNDS
                          4. TRAILER TYPE RECREATIONAL VEHICLE (TRAVEL TRAILERS AND CAMP TRAILERS)
                          VIN VERIFICATION BY AN OUT OF STATE MOTOR VEHICLE DEALER:
                          IF THE VEHICLE IDENTIFICATION NUMBER (VIN) IS VERIFIED BY AN OUT-OF-STATE MOTOR
                          VEHICLE DEALER, THE VERIFICATION MUST BE SUBMITTED ON THEIR LETTERHEAD
                          STATIONERY.
                          HSMV 82042
                          If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

                          sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
                          Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

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                          • #14
                            I know enough about trailers, etc. to know when Dave (Dabar39) tells you something, you can take it to the bank, to the DMV, to the freaking moon for that matter.

                            Arguing with Dabar39 about trailers (you've built one, he's built 700+) shows you're not here to learn. YOU ALREADY KNOW IT ALL.
                            Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                            Dynasty 200 DX
                            Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                            Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                            Hobart HH187
                            Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                            Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                            Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                            PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                            Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                            Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                            More grinders than hands

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Dave.
                              So if you agree with me why all this arguing.?
                              If the finished dump trailer weights 2000 lbs. or more there will be a title issued if his state has the same laws.
                              Does not matter if it's 10,000 or 14,000 or 18,000 GVW etc.
                              And if it is listed as home made or ASPT that's when they want an inspection to make sure it's road worthy, since a manufacturer did not make it. I am telling you that is what happen to me. Because I built it on my own..

                              But we did not go though this when I worked for a manufacturer. After the number was stamped on, after the weigh in after the invoice was payed, the customer towed it away. Unless it was to be delivered like I had to do, two trailers piggy back down to Naples. One tri axle and one tandem.

                              Some day I will have to tell you about some of the trailers we built. That's if you want to..

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