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air compressor

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  • air compressor

    I have an Idea to make an air compressor that i doubt any one has thought of before, an air powered air compresor. THe basic idea is to replace the motor with an impact wrench and have the wrench drawing air from the compressor a the same time the pump is suplying air to the tank. The compressor would have to be compressed the first time though anaxilary source, but if the tank doesnt leak it can alwase produce all of the power i needs. the impact would be tunrned on and off by means of a ball valve

  • #2
    Originally posted by metalmeltr View Post
    I have an Idea to make an air compressor that i doubt any one has thought of before, an air powered air compresor. THe basic idea is to replace the motor with an impact wrench and have the wrench drawing air from the compressor a the same time the pump is suplying air to the tank. The compressor would have to be compressed the first time though anaxilary source, but if the tank doesnt leak it can alwase produce all of the power i needs. the impact would be tunrned on and off by means of a ball valve

    What happens when the tool you're using and the impact running the compressor consumes more CFM than the pump can produce?

    How can I hold the trigger on the impact and run the air tool 75ft away simultaneously?

    How will the blows from the anvil in the impact affect operation and longevity?

    Finally, EVERY air compressor I've ever used eventually leaks down.

    I'll give you credit for trying, but I think your idea needs a lot of work.

    Comment


    • #3
      While your at it put an electric motor on your engine drive instead of the engine and let the machine make its own power to run itself.

      Trust me your not the only person to think of that.

      The air draw of the air motor that you would need to run it would consume more air than it would give out in power.

      I do congradulate you on trying to come up with a good idea.

      Dont give up on your inventions.

      Comment


      • #4
        Like if you really wanted to get creative you could put a big air storage tank in the trunk of a car and then you could get a really big air motor to replace the engine and, like, you then could connect a compressor to the drive shaft so it would compress air in the tank in the trunk and then the compressed air could run the engine air motor and it would move the car and the drive shaft would run the compressor to fill the tank in the trunk and the air motor would move the car......... and....by golly, you've got free energy!

        Comment


        • #5
          I wasnt to sure it would work either but I thought I would throw it out ther I also had an idea to do this with a lawnmower, but I dont think that will work either now. If i get the chance and have the parts laying around some time I may try it as an expiriment

          Comment


          • #6
            'Perpetual-motion machine' is the basis of the concept and it's been tried in so many different concepts it's amazing. Keep at it, nobody's come up with a way to do it without the addition of more energy to keep the process going. If you succeed, you'll have done what no other scientist or physicist has been able to do, and they've been at it for centuries!

            Tesla will be a clown compared to you!

            Einstein who?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by MTBob View Post
              Like if you really wanted to get creative you could put a big air storage tank in the trunk of a car and then you could get a really big air motor to replace the engine and, like, you then could connect a compressor to the drive shaft so it would compress air in the tank in the trunk and then the compressed air could run the engine air motor and it would move the car and the drive shaft would run the compressor to fill the tank in the trunk and the air motor would move the car......... and....by golly, you've got free energy!
              I was just going to post that I have considered this also, but another dea is o eliminte the compressor and replace the air tank with the big CO2 cylinder off the MIG, refuel at your local welding suplier.

              Some Creep- I have herd of a perpetual motion machine, herd no one has done it(yet) and thought of the benifits of figuring it out.

              Comment


              • #8
                metalmeltr

                If your last idea is to run air tools from a CO2 cyl. it can and does work. You can buy small CO2 bottles, like those used on paintball guns at Lowes. They sell a regulator and hose kit to be used with those to power nailguns. You can get the bottles filled at any location that fills paintball guns.

                I have a similar setup for my nailers. Instead of spending money on the paintball tanks I use several small SCUBA cylinders I have (19cf). I use scuba reg to lower the pressure down to 125 from 3000 then use a std air reg to adj the pressure to the gun. I already have the hoses to refill the small bottles from either my doubles or the large K bottles of breathing gas I get at the LWS. I use this setup when I just have to shoot in a couple of nails on a single door for example. Otherwise I just break out the pancake comp. and use that if I have any quantity to do.

                The biggest issue with this is that many tools like impact wrenches eat a LOT of volume. I think my impact gun eats 6cf/m + at 100psi. A large tank will work but don't expect long usage from a fill. You also have to be sure the reg can handle the volume required.

                I can and do use the big comp air bottles to run my plasma. The dry air from the bottles works better than that from my comp. Since I already have the air it just makes sense.
                Last edited by DSW; 02-05-2009, 06:09 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Perpetual motion, I aint thought of that in years.
                  Gravity and friction are the killers of perpetual motion.
                  Good luck with it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    With the talk of running air tools of tanks.

                    Make sure that you never use pure oxegen to run air tools.

                    The sudden blast of the oxegen inside the air tool can be fatal.
                    Also never use oil on your torches or gauges.

                    They actually say that if you ever decide to fix your own regulators that the natural oil in your hand is enouph to cause an explosion.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Portable Welder View Post
                      They actually say that if you ever decide to fix your own regulators that the natural oil in your hand is enouph to cause an explosion.
                      A fingerprint "weighs" about 50 micrograms.

                      Assuming 100% of the mass of a fingerprint was hydrocarbon oils (which isn't even close... lots of salts, etc.) and using the heat of complete combustion (oxygenated explosion) of these oils at an average of 50kJ/gram, the energy released in the "explosion" is 2.5 Joules, or 1.8 foot-pounds. That's less energy than a flashlight running for 1 second.

                      I'd like to know who "they" are so I can ask them what they get out of starting urban myths.

                      Now if we're talking about a gram of oil in the regulator, that's 50kJ or 36,900 foot pounds... 15 times the muzzle energy of a 30-06 rifle round. Now that's something to worry about!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Bodybagger, not saying you are incorrect. Actually I tend to agree with you as I work on HP O2 gear and have never heard about needing to wear gloves during a rebuild. Its the energy part I disagree with.

                        All you need is a seed catalyst to begin the combustion. Once ignited almost anything will burn in the presence of 100% O2.

                        Here's a couple of picts of an O2 fire.

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                        I had just checked the line and it was slightly warm when this happened. As you can see from the photos something went wrong. Output line pressure was aprox. 1450-1500psi. I wish I could find my before picts. If you look at the bottom of the booster you will see 2 loose lines. That’s what is left of the outlet lines. The 1/2"SS HP fitting that went into the booster, 5 of the SS 1/4" tube to 1/4" npt swageloc fittings that attached the 2 SS HP Tees, and the interconnecting 20" of 1/4" SS HP tubing is GONE, vaporized in an instant. If you look closely you can see the remaining half of the 6th adapter to the first tee in the bottom of the picts. The 2 tees survived but looked like someone burned all the threads out with a torch. I used to have one of the tees but someone walked off with it. My guess from the damage is that the fireball had to be about 24-30” in dia. in order to get all of my arm.

                        My hand was just about where you see that partial fitting. 3rd degree burns on my right hand from finger tips to elbow, about 85-90% of my lower arm. Flash charred all the skin but was over so fast there was little depth to the burns. One week in the burn ward and lite duty for the next couple of months, you can hardly see the scars. Small amounts pin point amounts of SS spatter on my upper arm, chest and face. Thank god for glasses! Burns stopped where my skin was protected by my cotton t shirt.

                        Even though I was at ground zero there was no concussion, only a fireball. However had something like a tank valve vaporized there would have been serious consequences. The day after I got out of the hospital a woman with whom I was personally familiar, died in an O2 explosion in a shop in Florida. Most likely cause was oil contaminated dirt that entered the valve when the customer dropped the tank in the parking lot. Tank exploded when she hooked up the partially filled tank. Tank valve open, fill valve closed. Several others were injured in the explosion. I'm still looking for my copies of the picts of that tank and will post them if I find them.


                        Now what happened. Possible causes,
                        1) Foreign matter into system from valve (spider web perhaps)
                        2) Foreign matter from system ( piece of brass from valves due to poor maintenance)
                        3) Oil contamination from air system (due to poor maintenance)
                        4) Adiabatic compression
                        5) Check valve failure on output of booster.
                        6) Operator error (unlikely due to the fact I was watching the pressure going in and it couldn’t do that if a valve was closed.)

                        We talked to the mfg of the booster and sent it to them for analysis. They were unable to determine the cause because most of the lower piston and valve assembly was vaporized in the flash. However they say this is not an uncommon occurrence in the airline industry where they use these boosters to fill O2 bottles for the flight crew. Their solution put the unit in a blast cabinet and LET IT BLOW UP! Go figure. Our sister companies compressor techs believe check valve failure due to similar failures on HP compressors. When the valve fails hot discharge gas flows back into the piston and is recompressed raising the temp. only a few cycles would have been needed to severely raise the output temps.


                        The moral of this long winded post is not to underestimate the destructive potential of O2.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          An air impact is what??? About 10% efficient, maybe 15 tops? Takes 6 to 10 times the energy to compress the air and turn it back to rotary action.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            BodyBagger, I certainly dont want to pretend that I know any of the scientific formulus that you seem to know.

                            I do know that over the years I have tied to get parts for regulators and they absolutely would never sell them.

                            It was about 3 different shops over the years that I was told no too.

                            I have also taken classes about torch safety at some of the welding shows that I have went to over the years and I've been doing this for 26 years now.

                            So I'm just passing along knowlege that I've been taught at these torch safety classes.

                            I've been to the Victor, Smith and Harris classes.

                            So you may be right about not enouph oil on your hand to cause a problem but I see no reason to find out the hard way.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Metalmeltr, in the meantime I wouldn't be quitting the day job just yet.

                              Comment

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