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  • Aluminum joint problem

    I am trying to tig a t joint. Material is alum... .060 wall...1.5" x 3/8" extruded
    box. Tig is Syncro 200. My problem is I can't seem to get my heat at the joint corner/seam. The filler will stick to either side of the joint and after enough
    heat is applied, the filler can bridge the gap between the two making for a larger fillet than necessary. If I really apply heat directly at the joint,it may start to fall apart before I get the filler to flow. So far I suck at this.
    Any suggestions? Tricks?
    Nick
    Miller 252 Mig
    Miller Cricket XL
    Millermatic 150 Mig
    Miller Syncrowave 200 Tig
    2-O/A outfits
    Jet Lathe and Mill
    Jet 7x12 horz/vert band saw
    DeWalt Multi Cutter metal saw
    Century 50 Amp Plasma Cutter
    20 ton electric/hydraulic vertical press
    Propane Forge
    60" X 60" router/plasma table

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTu7wicVCmQ
    Vist my site: www.nixstuff.com
    and check out some of my ironwork and other stuff

  • #2
    I'm far from an expert, but I was recently playing with aluminum T-joints as well. What ended up working for me, since the leg would melt the fastest, was to focus the heat a bit more on the base and occasionally flick it up a bit to the leg. When adding the filler, aim the rod more towards the leg and let it work itself into the joint. And if that fails, ignore my advice.

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    • #3
      When you start an arc on aluminum, it wants to jump from one piece to the other, and not focus.

      The solution is to start very hot, melt the filler into the joint (even if it looks like it's only bridging the gap), and after that you'll be able to add filler in the normal way, as the arc won't jump any longer, because your two pieces are now one.

      Some people try to start the arc directly on the filler, placed in the joint.

      -James

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      • #4
        focus your arc on the bottom piece, remember-heat rises, this will also heat your vertical piece, allow your work to get up to temperature, add a little rod, adjust your torch angle, and you're off to the races...
        Miller Syncrowave 250

        6000+ hrs Al TIG

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        • #5
          Monte,
          Got any pics.
          T.J.
          Miller Dynasty 300DX
          HTP MIG 240
          HTP 380 Plasma

          Bridgeport Milling Machine
          South Bend Lathe
          Etc. Etc....
          tjsperformance.com

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          • #6
            I find that starting slow and getting some heat in the part works for me, it also gives more time for cleaning. as you see a bright spot (melting) start to form on one or both, add some filler to the root and it will quickly melt in, once that first spot is in place it will flow from there. I have also found that learning fillets on slightly thicker material helps.
            Dynasty 200 DX
            Millermatic 175
            Spectrum 375
            All kinds of Smith OA gear

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            • #7
              Some things are easier to show than type I would just tell you to turn up the HZ but you can't
              Anyway there have been a few good suggestions but the truth is if you are adding filler without heating the root you ain't helping anything. What I do is start more towards the middle than you want the bead to be and bring up the heat slowly. Sometimes I am angling the torch enuff to touch the cup on both parts of the joint at this stage. Sorta rock the cup/torch a bit as you bring up the heat and work BACKHAND slowly watching the shiny part on both sides come ever so closer together. when the 2 pools get to the edges they will either jump together or a keyhole will open...THEN feed filler and work forhand as usual. Any time you add filler before the root is fluid you are just bridging a gap add making the bead fat.
              HTH.
              Oh yea...make sure you got the tunsten out aways and grinding a point on it while using lanthanated would help also...prolly 3/32
              Last edited by FusionKing; 03-06-2008, 06:48 AM.

              www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
              Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
              MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
              Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
              Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

              Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
              Miller 30-A Spoolgun
              Miller WC-115-A
              Miller Spectrum 300
              Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
              Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

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              • #8
                Thanks for all the replies. They all make sense to me. I'll just keep trying untill it's correct.
                Info....red 3/32 tung..
                Shield gas 20cfh
                amps 100
                med start
                3/32 filler..4043 I think
                With stuff this light, I think preheat is not needed unless I could direct a small flame where the two meet.
                How close can a magnetic dial indicator base on a 5/8" 44" x 96" steel table
                be to the weld area and not affect the arc?

                Nick
                Nick
                Miller 252 Mig
                Miller Cricket XL
                Millermatic 150 Mig
                Miller Syncrowave 200 Tig
                2-O/A outfits
                Jet Lathe and Mill
                Jet 7x12 horz/vert band saw
                DeWalt Multi Cutter metal saw
                Century 50 Amp Plasma Cutter
                20 ton electric/hydraulic vertical press
                Propane Forge
                60" X 60" router/plasma table

                www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTu7wicVCmQ
                Vist my site: www.nixstuff.com
                and check out some of my ironwork and other stuff

                Comment


                • #9
                  Also turn the balance up and I'd certainly loose the red.

                  www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
                  Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
                  MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
                  Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
                  Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

                  Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
                  Miller 30-A Spoolgun
                  Miller WC-115-A
                  Miller Spectrum 300
                  Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
                  Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    try a smaller filler, 1/16" to start.

                    for your tungsten don't sharped it as much, since the electricity works from the cross section of the electrode this will move the arc closer to the joint. I know that intuition would say to make it sharper but that will move the arc bell up the electrode. reference AWS welding handbook eigth edition page 82 figure 3.5

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
                      Also turn the balance up and I'd certainly loose the red.
                      Why do you say lose the red? What do you recommend? The reason I am using red is so many have stated that's all they use and pure tung (green) doesn't hold up as well.
                      I switched to green last night and noticed that the ball on the end of the tungsten is about the size diameter of the tung or slightly larger and the ball stays shiney.
                      The red would develop a ball but much smaller and you can still see the grind
                      angle of the tungsten.
                      Nick
                      Miller 252 Mig
                      Miller Cricket XL
                      Millermatic 150 Mig
                      Miller Syncrowave 200 Tig
                      2-O/A outfits
                      Jet Lathe and Mill
                      Jet 7x12 horz/vert band saw
                      DeWalt Multi Cutter metal saw
                      Century 50 Amp Plasma Cutter
                      20 ton electric/hydraulic vertical press
                      Propane Forge
                      60" X 60" router/plasma table

                      www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTu7wicVCmQ
                      Vist my site: www.nixstuff.com
                      and check out some of my ironwork and other stuff

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I've always used lanthanated(yellow) tungstens on aluminum, and red on steel and stainless. Yellow forms a ball but still keeps some what of a taper on it.
                        Welders do it hotter!!
                        www.Munsonworks.com

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by monte55 View Post
                          Why do you say lose the red? What do you recommend? The reason I am using red is so many have stated that's all they use and pure tung (green) doesn't hold up as well.
                          I switched to green last night and noticed that the ball on the end of the tungsten is about the size diameter of the tung or slightly larger and the ball stays shiney.
                          The red would develop a ball but much smaller and you can still see the grind
                          angle of the tungsten.
                          I guess if the red is all you have then use it...I'm not much of a green lover either...it just goes away too fast for me. I don't like red because it eventually erodes too bad and grinding happens too much for me.
                          I much prefer to use the lanthanated on everything nowadays. It holds up well both AC and DC and doesn't erode as bad as red on AC.
                          I also like the smaller filler for the thin stuff.

                          www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
                          Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
                          MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
                          Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
                          Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

                          Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
                          Miller 30-A Spoolgun
                          Miller WC-115-A
                          Miller Spectrum 300
                          Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
                          Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            When using 1/16" filler, you'll need to keep a steeper torch angle. If your push angle is too steep, the heat will melt the filler before it gets to the puddle. This isn't a problem with 3/32".
                            RETIRED desk jockey.

                            Hobby weldor with a little training.

                            Craftsman O/A---Flat, Vert, Ovhd, Horz.

                            Miller Syncrowave 250.
                            sigpic

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                            • #15
                              different subject...

                              Hey Monte, didn't you post something about a hovercraft somewhere from days of old? Any pictures. I always had a thing for hovercraft...

                              Thanks,
                              John

                              Thunderbolt AC/DC
                              MM 175
                              Maxstar 150 STL
                              Blue Star 185 DX
                              Spectrum 375

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