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  • What Rods to buy

    I am about to start making a yard trailer for my tractor primarily out of 3" channel and angle. Wondering what electrodes would be best. I have a Maxstar 150 that I plan to use. Most of my welding has been done with a MIG, but for the trailer I want the increased penetration of GMAW. I have burned a lot of 7018 over the years and know it would work fine - but I do not have an oven to dry them with and I know that they are more sensitive to moisture than others.

    I'm wondering if I should go with 6010 or 7014 instead?

    Just looking for some opinions from the board. How sensitive are 7018 to moisture, do I really need to dry them, what about other types - are they as sensitive?


    Also interested in what others are doing to keep rods dry? I don't think my wife would be happy if I baked them in her oven.

    Thanks

  • #2
    Originally posted by Big_Eddy View Post
    I am about to start making a yard trailer for my tractor primarily out of 3" channel and angle. Wondering what electrodes would be best. I have a Maxstar 150 that I plan to use. Most of my welding has been done with a MIG, but for the trailer I want the increased penetration of GMAW. I have burned a lot of 7018 over the years and know it would work fine - but I do not have an oven to dry them with and I know that they are more sensitive to moisture than others.

    I'm wondering if I should go with 6010 or 7014 instead?

    Just looking for some opinions from the board. How sensitive are 7018 to moisture, do I really need to dry them, what about other types - are they as sensitive?


    Also interested in what others are doing to keep rods dry? I don't think my wife would be happy if I baked them in her oven.

    Thanks
    Hi Ed.

    I am thinking this GMAW (mig) was a typo and you meant SMAW (stick). I am also thinking you have a misunderstanding of welding in general, as SMAW offers no more penetration than GMAW in general. GMAW would be the fastest way to weld a trailer. If you are looking at this project as a way to get/keep your hand in "stick welding" then I would go with 7018 for tight fit joints and 6010 to close gaps in the looser fit joints and put a pass of 7018 over the top.

    I don't like 60xx alone for dynamically loaded structures.

    To keep your 7018, but in in small cans 5lbs or 10lbs and as soon as you open one put all the rod into plastic rod holder found at the lws for $6.00. Take out only what you can use in an hour and all will be fine.

    The cheap rod oven is an old refrigerator with a few light bulbs continually left on (yes while the door is shut ) Most home ovens do not get hot enough to re-bake lo/hy rods, as Lincoln wants them bakes at 700 deg F.


    If you just want to make damed sure that this project has a proper weld and that is the point of this post: then I would stay with the GMAW (mig) just gap all the joints by about 1/8" to 3/16" you'll have all the penetration you need.


    TJ
    TJ______________________________________

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    • #3
      Yes - I meant SMAW - not GMAW - my bad typing. My primary reason for stick is that my MIG is only 110V and while it is fine for gauge metal - I would not trust my ability to weld together a trailer with it - even if it is a yard trailer only.

      I know that I can get better penetration with stick. I also know that with the right equipment - MIG is faster and better - but with my equipment it would not be.

      Thanks for the guidelines on the rods - If 5-10 lbs will stay good in the rod keeper for a short time- then I will stick with the 7018 as I have always had good results with them.

      Can you really get 700 degrees in a fridge with lightbulbs on? Wow!
      Last edited by Big_Eddy; 04-20-2007, 11:16 AM. Reason: grammar

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      • #4
        which rods?

        Depending on your stick abilities, I would use 7018's or 6011's.
        The 6011 is a good general purpose rod with a good weldment in the vertical ups and overhead positions. The 6011 is (to me ) the easiest rod to burn and is more than sufficient for what you are wanting to do. Dave
        If necessity is the Mother of Invention, I must be the Father of Desperation!

        sigpicJohn Blewett III 10-22-73 to 8-16-07
        Another racing great gone but not to be forgotten.http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...modified&hl=en

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        • #5
          Fat-fab, I just bought a used rod oven and filled it with 7018. It has adjustable temp and I have it set low. I thought that you just needed to keep the moisture out of the rod. I read your post about keeping it at 700deg? Is that what it's supposed to be kept at?
          Thanks, Shane
          Modern Metalworking LLC
          Modern Metalworking L.L.C
          Blissfiled, MI
          517-605-9481

          Miller Dynasty 350 Tig runner
          Hobart 3-phase mig
          Hypertherm 1000 plasma
          Mill
          Lathe
          Box break
          Shear

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          • #6
            Originally posted by swyman View Post
            Fat-fab, I just bought a used rod oven and filled it with 7018. It has adjustable temp and I have it set low. I thought that you just needed to keep the moisture out of the rod. I read your post about keeping it at 700deg? Is that what it's supposed to be kept at?
            Thanks, Shane
            Modern Metalworking LLC

            As to rod temp: for storage 7018 should be kept between 250F/300F. For rod that has been out of storage for more than 4 hours it is to be heated for several hours at 700f and then put into longterm storage either hermetically sealed or in the oven at 250-300F. More detail can be had at http://www.lincolnelectric.com/knowl...nt/storing.asp All of what I just wrote is from memory.





            Originally posted by Big_Eddy View Post
            Yes - I meant SMAW - not GMAW - my bad typing. My primary reason for stick is that my MIG is only 110V and while it is fine for gauge metal - I would not trust my ability to weld together a trailer with it - even if it is a yard trailer only.

            I know that I can get better penetration with stick. I also know that with the right equipment - MIG is faster and better - but with my equipment it would not be.

            Thanks for the guidelines on the rods - If 5-10 lbs will stay good in the rod keeper for a short time- then I will stick with the 7018 as I have always had good results with them.

            Can you really get 700 degrees in a fridge with lightbulbs on? Wow!
            I see what you are talking about regarding the 110v mig machine. you'll defiantly be happier with the stick results than what you would get from the mig.

            I have had fine luck with the rod keepers for up to three months as long as I put the rod into them right out of the can and then use from the same keeper till empty. I usually buy fifty pounds at a time and put 20 lbs into my two rod ovens and the rest into the keepers.

            TJ
            TJ______________________________________

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            • #7
              you can always bake your rod in oven but dont know how wife feel about it. i bake my wire at 250 degrees for about 2 hours if it gets wet. but if your using lo-hy you can always put a few rods close to the joint your welding and let it heat it up. unless your dipping them in water i wouldnt worry about them. just keep them covered up when not in use.

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              • #8
                So how do you know when a 7018 rod has gone bad? I mean, if it isn't stored properly and you start to weld with it, what are the signs to look for?

                I use mainlly 6010 and keep them in rod guard cases. I guess I've never seen one go bad - or perhaps I thought it was just my welding that s*u*c*k*e*d.
                Millermatic 35
                Miller TB302G
                Ellis 1800
                Smith & Victor Torches
                Optrel Satellite
                Arcair K4000
                Ingersoll-Rand 175CFM Diesel Air Compressor
                Home Made Welding Trailer

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                • #9
                  you will just know when one is bad. another thing you can do is stick the rod let it heat up and break it off and use it

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                  • #10
                    rods
                    is it true if you take the rod and tap it on something and the flux falls off the rod is no good. had a guy tell me that
                    miller bobcat 250
                    wc 115a
                    spoolmatic 30a
                    centery 250 mic
                    2 lincoln 225 stick
                    a 1954 hobart portable welder w/ willies jeep engine

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by garybdavis View Post
                      So how do you know when a 7018 rod has gone bad? I mean, if it isn't stored properly and you start to weld with it, what are the signs to look for?

                      I use mainlly 6010 and keep them in rod guard cases. I guess I've never seen one go bad - or perhaps I thought it was just my welding that s*u*c*k*e*d.
                      Old 7018 will have a harder time keeping an arc it will wander a bit as the density of the flux changes the arc can "escape" out the side. The big concern with keeping 7018 "dry" is for those welding to code and those that will be inspected. For building a farm trailer of for general farm repairs just but it in small amounts and keep it in air/water tight containers and all will be fine.

                      TJ
                      TJ______________________________________

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                      • #12
                        What I've done is taken out whats going to be used and left the rest in the can and the can stored in a cool dry place.
                        I also wouldnt worry about the oven unless code work is going to be done to some; or any degree.
                        Some 70 grade or higher mig wire should be fine also.
                        6010 on this job for me would be over-kill 6013-7014 can get the job done for you to and the rods will be less than that beautiful 7018

                        Dave.
                        strive for perfection..but be willing to accept excellence.

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