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6010 and 7018 rod for pipe

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  • #16
    JTMcC,

    Hats off to you. It is obvious you do more pipe than I being the owner of a small pipe welding business. Pipe welding is not my main business. I typcially do 10,000' or less of 14"-30" and 3000' or less 1"-2" per year. Most of what I do is low pressure application. As for the procedures I have listed is what we have to follow even on thin wall low pressure piping.

    The information I have posted and you disagree with comes from K.E. Bergman. They are an international piping and bellows firm. A family member has been welding pipe for 40 + years and is currently employed by this firm. This individual and the companies he has worked with is how I learned to weld pipe uphill and downhill travel.

    As for our disageement I have none. I too am only speaking with what I am familiar with and the procedures we must follow where I weld.

    We are both speaking from experience. I thank you from informing me of how things are done more recently. The techniques and application I am familiar with are older procedures from the 60's and early 70's and the limited areas where I currently work with pipe.

    Again thank for the updated information.

    Comment


    • #17
      JTMcC
      I am not a pipewelder but very curious about why you are so vehement... can you give us a Welding Procedure Specification that supports your position... this could be a matter of safety so we might all benefit from your knowledge..
      thanks
      Heiti
      .

      *******************************************
      The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

      “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

      Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

      My Blue Stuff:
      Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
      Dynasty 200DX
      Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
      Millermatic 200

      TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

      Comment


      • #18
        Well it's just a fact, heavy wall pipe (1" plus), in high pressure applications is welded every day downhill, as well as up. A lot of people will dispute that, based, IMO, on published information, but we do it regularly.

        I have a 3 ring binder in my truck with over 50 procedures in it (as required by law), but I don't think any of them will shed light on down vs. uphill pipe welding as they don't indicate the use or pressure of any final product.

        I don't see any safety issue, no one is going to spec a high pressure piping procedure cuz they heard something on the internet, from some guy they never met : ), they will probably use the appropriate code.

        regards,
        JTMcC.
        Some days you eat the bear. And some days the bear eats you.

        Comment


        • #19
          JTMcC
          have me a little lost here..the specs (WPS) tend to be pretty specific..
          and your nebulous answer has me a little concerened.. if you will bear with me.. here is a link to recognized pipewelding Qual tests

          http://www.ajtraining.org/weldtestspecs.html

          and the pertinent (SMAW) tests do indeed specify style of welding..
          could you clarify please?

          thanks
          Heiti
          .

          *******************************************
          The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

          “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

          Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

          My Blue Stuff:
          Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
          Dynasty 200DX
          Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
          Millermatic 200

          TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

          Comment


          • #20
            H80N i believe there maybe more wpq codes than the ones UA are showing..
            thanks Jim






            Comment


            • #21
              Scott
              of course there are!!!... was just trying to find out why this fellow so vehemently objected to what HAWK and others had said.. and thought any documentation to support such a strong stand would have been presented in a flash.. would be happy to read any other WPQ's and WPS's that are out there.. but as of right now.. all of the "FACTS" that I have seen.. seem to suggest that this might be his personal preference rather than formally accepted method...
              hope that clarifies a bit
              thanks
              Heiti
              .

              *******************************************
              The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

              “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

              Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

              My Blue Stuff:
              Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
              Dynasty 200DX
              Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
              Millermatic 200

              TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

              Comment


              • #22
                My "position" is simply this (for about the third time now) heavy wall, high pressure pipe is welded every day downhill. There isn't anything hard about this, it's a fact.
                When you turn up the natural gas furnace, use your gas stove, or take a shower and enjoy the hot water from your gas water heater, you are taking advantage of the fact that welders have made several million downhill welds on cross country pipelines and the compression stations that push that gas to your town. On pipe, much of it heavy wall, and all of it high pressure. You don't have to believe if you wish not too : )
                These historical facts are just that, facts. Really I wouldn't make such a thing up. And no WPS on the planet can prove to you my "point".
                I am a UA member by the way.
                And we do this work, high pressure piping, both down and up, mostly down in my case, on a regular basis.
                Please don't take offense at anything I say, I'm only trying to put accurate information out on work we do daily, take it for what it's worth, and believe whatever tickles your fancy.

                bye,
                JTMcC.
                Some days you eat the bear. And some days the bear eats you.

                Comment


                • #23
                  JTMcC
                  so if I read you correctly you are saying that it is done BOTH ways and not neccesarily that the other fellas were full of.. er..beans...
                  thanks
                  Heiti
                  .

                  *******************************************
                  The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

                  “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

                  Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

                  My Blue Stuff:
                  Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
                  Dynasty 200DX
                  Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
                  Millermatic 200

                  TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    It may be done both ways except at the Marathon Ashland refinery in Canton Ohio. There its uphill all passes with 7018. Their rules it's their refinery. The inspector took a page from this book and another page total of 4 pages and made their own law. Sucks but that's what they want. 20 guys could not pass the test because they were used to a 6010 root downhill. Bob
                    Bob Wright

                    Spool Gun conversion. How To Do It. Below.
                    http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...php?albumid=48

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      aametalmaster,

                      That is exactly how I got my first paying pipe job. 12 guys failed the 6G uphill test on 1" schedule 40 and I was asked to try it. We were suppossed to to all 6010 uphill progression. One of the local union guys wanted to see who was watching what. He did a 6010 uphill on half a dozen roots and then capped uphill with 7018. The inspectors never blinked. On 1" schedule 40 there usually is no fill pass. The root is usually flush with the pipe. I am sure they noticed, but probably didn't not care as long as the pressure test passed: 400PSI @ 24 hours. These lines were only put into use for 90-100PSI continuous service for natural gas.

                      Uphill 7018 should not be too taxing except for the "good" possibility of not burning in the root depending on the wall thickness. I tested once on 6" schedule 160 with 1/8" 7018 A-1 and had to be persistent to get the burn in.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        HAWK,
                        I took the 6G test on 6" pipe 1/2" wall, 1/8" gap, pipe beveled to a 45 with no flat. Allowed 3 tacks, 100 percent pentration with no burn thru or undercutting on inside of pipe. Decided it was time for a career change I got tired of the inspector's face reflection in my helmet he watched every move. He could not understand why it took so long to weld up. I asked him how much he welded he said "never struck an arc" go figure. Took a job across the road in the operations part of the refinery. 25 years of welding was enough. Now I own my own company and play on the side..Bob
                        Bob Wright

                        Spool Gun conversion. How To Do It. Below.
                        http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...php?albumid=48

                        Comment

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