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Help something wrong with new smith regulator for mm252

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  • Help something wrong with new smith regulator for mm252

    I went to use my millermatic 252 today and did the usual, turned the c25 gas on really slow and then after the high pressure needle increased to its max, then opened the valve all the way.

    i always back out the regulator screw when finished for the day, I assume it is better to leave them this way when not being used for a few weeks.
    This time I noticed when increasing the screw tension the low pressure side didn't increase as usual like it was stuck and then it jumped up higher than I wanted, so I backed out the regulator screw a bit and then pulled the mig trigger to set the pressure in the range I wanted.

    The problem is the regulator needle is bouncing all over the place when I pull the mig trigger and i hear like a ding..ding..ding..ding..ding sound constantly coming from the regulator when I pull the mig trigger. I feel gas coming out the mig gun, but don't know why the regulator is making this sound or why the needle is jumping around.

    i get the same response from the regulator if I loosen the hose at the low pressure output side of the regulator and bleed it out to see if will maintain the fixed output pressure.

    anyone know what could be wrong? I'm pretty frustrated by this seeing this would have been my second chance to use the new welder.
    Last edited by clint738; 05-08-2013, 09:44 AM.

  • #2
    Because they are cheap, piece of crap regulators. Sounds like you need a new one. Aren't you glad you spent all that time unscrewing it and and bleeding the gas? I have just been setting them and forgetting them. I turn off the bottle but that is it. I have some regs that are very old, and some crap out right out of the box. Luck of the draw. You may want to make sure you don't have a leak, or debris in the inlet filter, otherwise replace it.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by walker View Post
      Because they are cheap, piece of crap regulators. Sounds like you need a new one. Aren't you glad you spent all that time unscrewing it and and bleeding the gas? I have just been setting them and forgetting them. I turn off the bottle but that is it. I have some regs that are very old, and some crap out right out of the box. Luck of the draw. You may want to make sure you don't have a leak, or debris in the inlet filter, otherwise replace it.
      How would I check the inlet filter? Don't know how it would have gotten debris in the regulator since I never disconnected it from the bottle once I installed it.

      i did crack the bottle valve to blow out any junk before installing the new regulator and the bottle valve looked clean inside.

      would a leak some where make the regulator do any of that dinging noises as well as the needling bouncing all around?
      Last edited by clint738; 04-23-2013, 09:49 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        I set em and forget em too, ya never know whats in those tanks brother, I'd take it all apart clean it and put it back and try it. If it still does it.... Use it for target practice and buy a new one...

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by clint738 View Post
          I went to use my millermatic 252 today and did the usual, turned the c25 gas on really slow and then after the high pressure needle increased to its max, then opened the valve all the way.

          i always back out the regulator screw when finished for the day, I assume it is better to leave them this way when not being used for a few weeks.
          This time I noticed when increasing the screw tension the low pressure side didn't increase as usual like it was stuck and then it jumped up higher than I wanted, so I backed out the regulator screw a bit and then pulled the mig trigger to set the pressure in the range I wanted.

          The problem is the regulator needle is bouncing all over the place when I pull the mig trigger and i hear like a ding..ding..ding..ding..ding sound constantly coming from the regulator when I pull the mig trigger. I feel gas coming out the mig gun, but don't know why the regulator is making this sound or why the needle is jumping around.

          i get the same response from the regulator if I loosen the hose at the low pressure output side of the regulator and bleed it out to see if will maintain the fixed output pressure.

          anyone know what could be wrong? I'm pretty frustrated by this seeing this would have been my second chance to use the new welder.

          Clint try running the screw in and out a few times, it could be something needs to be aligned or sealed better. I switched to flow meters, regulators are for the birds.

          You didn't use any Teflon tape when you threaded the regulator into the bottle? I heard that it can get inside regulators and ruin them. I just spit on the brass threads and run the nut in by hand, same O on the torch handle when changing to a welding tip, snug with a wrench.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by tackit View Post
            Clint try running the screw in and out a few times, it could be something needs to be aligned or sealed better. I switched to flow meters, regulators are for the birds.

            You didn't use any Teflon tape when you threaded the regulator into the bottle? I heard that it can get inside regulators and ruin them. I just spit on the brass threads and run the nut in by hand, same O on the torch handle when changing to a welding tip, snug with a wrench.
            Well not sure if you'd call it a regulator or a flow meter since it does read tank pressure and also CFH for flow rate. It is the smith regulator that comes new with the millermatic 252, I would have thought it was a good one. I just barely bought it all like march 15th and have only welded with it for about an hour. Regulator worked fine then.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Missouripipewelder View Post
              I set em and forget em too, ya never know whats in those tanks brother, I'd take it all apart clean it and put it back and try it. If it still does it.... Use it for target practice and buy a new one...
              Never taken one apart, so not sure how to do that. Thinking about taking it back to air gas and seeing what they say. Problem is I will have to take off work to drive to the store during their week day only office hours.

              Comment


              • #8
                Call Air Gas on the phone and describe the problem and see what they say before you take time off work and before you void any warranty on the regulator by taking it apart.-Meltedmetal

                Comment


                • #9
                  Clint here's what I'm running. http://store.cyberweld.com/mehrf14refl.html. Call airgas and tell them your work situation and what's happening, they might just send you a new regulator and the Flow meter/regulator. They know the regulators that come with new machines are troublesome. Mine went out too, I called Miller and they sent out a new one right away but I bought a new Victor flow meter/regulator from my WS.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Same thing happened to me last Friday. New Millermatic 252 with Smith regulator started making that noise. After I blew everything out, (which didn't help) I tapped on the back of the regulator with a rubber handle of a wrench. That seems to have cleared it up for me. It's unfortunate that great welders come with junky regulators.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This "flow gauge" as they are called I guess appears to be the one that comes with the MM252.
                      http://store.cyberweld.com/smflreh1.html#pdItemDataTabs

                      It for sure isn't a cheap flow gauge since it costs $89.75 If I had to replace is at my LWS it would easily be almost $100 with our 8.25% sales tax in TX.

                      It lists the regulator as made in the USA with a 3 year warranty, so I'll try calling the welding shop I bought everything from on my lunch break and see what they say. Hopefully Smith flow gauges are really good and this is just a rare incident.

                      Don't want to have to fork out another $100+ to get a working flow meter/gauge.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If this is a new machine I cannot see any reason the seller would not warranty the flow gauge.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Why is regulator acting up???

                          Well let me start by saying that I called the AirGas I bought the welder from and they said they would order me a new regulator. Friday I took the afternoon off from work and made the 80+ mile round trip drive to exchange my regulator for the replacement.

                          Right out of the box everything worked fine. Got to spend a saturday making some brackets for new outlet boxes and spent about 30-45mins actually welding with the new Millermatic 252. Turned off the bottle, backed off the regulator/flowgauge pressure knob and bled off the line pressure using the welder trigger. 2 weeks went by and I went to use the welder for a project to help a friend and a local club I'm in and found the regulator was acting up like in the video so couldn't use the new welder.

                          Here is what my new with the MM252 Smith regulator was doing:
                          https://www.dropbox.com/s/izka0w7gm7...429_175742.mp4

                          I tried the advice I read by someone on the forum by using the rubber end of a wrench and tapping on the regulator. Well that actually appeared to fix it as seen here:
                          https://www.dropbox.com/s/lywdtkd75m...429_181746.mp4

                          But having not seen a regulator ever act up like in the first video, I was uncertain if the problem would reoccur later. So I went ahead and exchanged my regulator for the one the Miller welding shop had asked Miller to send.

                          I guess lightning can strike twice because it turns out the 2nd one appears to be faulty too as seen in this video.
                          https://www.dropbox.com/s/5r7dzygt7x...504_193740.mp4

                          The output flow gauge pressure drops all the way to zero and stays there until I let off the mig trigger. The replacement gauge will not maintain the output pressure.

                          I tried tapping on the regulator like I did on the first one, but it hasn't helped it.
                          I wondered if maybe the problem was with the new Millermatic 252 I bought last month that has seen about 30-45mins of welding total. So I tried making more videos, this time without the welder attached to the meter output side.
                          Here I just increased the regulator screw to get around 25cfh as the Miller settings chart indicates as the gas setting.

                          Here is the video without the welder connected:
                          https://www.dropbox.com/s/lnyyzv7ugd...505_195854.mp4

                          Does anyone know what could be causing the regulators/flow gauge to act up like this, is this ever common?

                          This is getting rather frustrating since I had to use some of my accumulated paid time off from work and waste my time and my gas for an 80+ mile round trip to get a factory replacement part that has not fixed the problem. And now it looks like I may have to do it again to bring back the so called replacement part.

                          I also had intentions of doing a welding project for my sister-in-law for her wedding shower this next weekend, but now can't since my new MM252 is out of commission because the regulator/flowmeter is not working correctly.

                          I'm going to call the AirGas tomorrow and mention the problems I now have with the replacement gauge. I'll keep posted what the outcome is, but I was hoping to get some advice from the guys who weld everyday on what could be the issue with this regulator/flowmeter?

                          Thanks for any suggestions/help you have,
                          Clint
                          Last edited by clint738; 05-06-2013, 07:31 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Clint, Victor makes a true flow meter in the same price range. See if the LWS will swap you one of those.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Help something wrong with new smith regulator for mm252

                              Are u sure that u don't have a tank that is contaminated ?
                              I have used Smith torches with Smith regulators for many years. Have even switched back & forth from propane & Acy. With same regulators.
                              My 350P runs almost every day for 1-1/2 year still has Smith reg. on it. I never back off stem or bleed off tank, just turn off & back on next day.
                              I do buy a true flow meter if I replace them and run flow meter on my Tig.
                              Possible to have 2 bad regulators but not probable. I would call Smith and ask them before drive another 80 mile.
                              >> any welding shops near u ? Most of us hv a extra regulator u could borrow to do ur project for weekend?
                              Greg

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