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  • argon flow setting

    When I went to school for tig welding my instructors had me use nothing but a gas lense. I am now in a situation where I need to use a standard body non gas lense. Will it require less cfh. I normally use around 12 to 15 cfh with the gas lense.

  • #2
    Try it at 12 to 15, then kick it up a little. The gas lense is great for pulling your tungsten out more than normal, as well as the other benefits.

    A more needle like tungsten grind helps as well.
    Nothing welded, Nothing gained

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    • #3
      We run ours at 30. Although I've seen a lot of posts that use 25.

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      • #4
        I run between 10-20 depending. For a non gas lens setup 15-20 will be fine. Much more and you can start to pull oxygen into the weld area.

        -Dan
        Owner
        DW Metalworks LLC
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        • #5
          Originally posted by striker12300 View Post
          We run ours at 30. Although I've seen a lot of posts that use 25.
          I would rethink 25 to 30 cfh. It takes a good amount of energy to produce your argon, and that means money. I just put a gas lense on my DX200 with air cooled torch and pulled my gas flow down to 10cfh. Otherwise I was running a 12 to 15 cfh with the standard collet body.

          At work, We run maximum 20 cfh on our 4 Dynasty 350s, welding 1" to 1" alum plate and bar, and #8 cups. Only do I run 25cfh on my CobraMig and MillerMatic 350P, both using alum wire.
          Nothing welded, Nothing gained

          Miller Dynasty700DX
          3 ea. Miller Dynasty350DX
          Miller Dynasty200DX
          ThermalArc 400 GTSW
          MillerMatic350P
          MillerMatic200 with spoolgun
          MKCobraMig260
          Lincoln SP-170T
          Linde UCC305 (sold 2011)
          Hypertherm 1250
          Hypertherm 800
          PlasmaCam CNC cutter
          Fadal Toolroom CNC Mill
          SiberHegner CNC Mill
          2 ea. Bridgeport
          LeBlond 15" Lathe
          Haberle 18" Cold Saw
          Doringer 14" Cold Saw
          6 foot x 12 foot Mojave granite

          Comment


          • #6
            1. Your "instructor" should have taught you how to determine your optimal flow rate. Don't know how you expect anyone else to tell you where to set your flow rate. Depends on the situation.

            2. Some posters must either work for the "gas supplier" or don't know jack about tig welding. Too much gas flow can be just as bad or worse than not enough.

            Depending on cup size, stickout, etc keep dropping your flow rate by about 2CFH until you start to see porosity in your "test bead". Bump it back up till the porosity disappears. That's your base. I normally run about 3-5CFH higher than my base.

            Using helium or a helium/argon mix is going to require a much higher flow rate due to the specific gravity (lighter than air) of the He.
            Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
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            • #7
              Originally posted by striker12300 View Post
              We run ours at 30. Although I've seen a lot of posts that use 25.
              On TIG? That sounds like numbers usually reserved for MIG.

              For steel you can get away with less flow. With aluminum I dial in 5 cfh more.

              #7-#8 cup just about 15 for steel - maybe as high as 22 for aluminum.

              #5-#6 is more like 12 cfh for steel - right in the middle between 15-20 for aluminum.

              You can of course get even larger cups, just need to adjust flow accordingly. Miller does have on-line calculator that will give you a starting point to try.

              For non gas lens, use the same flow numbers, just remember to keep the tungsten stickout less than the nozzle diameter. #8 cup is 8/16ths of an inch or 1/2 inch. The less stickout the better.

              I try to use #7 cup for aluminum (I actually don't have a #8 right now) and #6 for steel. I have #4 and #5's available but they pretty much look brand spanking new.

              For each tungsten I have the normal, non gas lens collets and holders. I hardly ever use them. I have one use for them and it has to do with burning off zinc where I can't grind - the spatter would (and has) destroyed a gas lens (at least the outer screen).

              I had an older torch that you couldn't buy a lens for, replaced it pretty much as soon as I found out about gas lenses.
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              • #8
                Originally posted by SundownIII View Post
                1. Your "instructor" should have taught you how to determine your optimal flow rate. Don't know how you expect anyone else to tell you where to set your flow rate. Depends on the situation.

                2. Some posters must either work for the "gas supplier" or don't know jack about tig welding. Too much gas flow can be just as bad or worse than not enough.

                Depending on cup size, stickout, etc keep dropping your flow rate by about 2CFH until you start to see porosity in your "test bead". Bump it back up till the porosity disappears. That's your base. I normally run about 3-5CFH higher than my base.

                Using helium or a helium/argon mix is going to require a much higher flow rate due to the specific gravity (lighter than air) of the He.
                Man, that was perfectly stated.
                Nothing welded, Nothing gained

                Miller Dynasty700DX
                3 ea. Miller Dynasty350DX
                Miller Dynasty200DX
                ThermalArc 400 GTSW
                MillerMatic350P
                MillerMatic200 with spoolgun
                MKCobraMig260
                Lincoln SP-170T
                Linde UCC305 (sold 2011)
                Hypertherm 1250
                Hypertherm 800
                PlasmaCam CNC cutter
                Fadal Toolroom CNC Mill
                SiberHegner CNC Mill
                2 ea. Bridgeport
                LeBlond 15" Lathe
                Haberle 18" Cold Saw
                Doringer 14" Cold Saw
                6 foot x 12 foot Mojave granite

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hey SUNDOWN I am still sort of a noob when it comes to tig welding. Sorry I wasn't born with a tig torch in my mouth. I wasn't looking for exact numbers just some info from people more experienced than me. Oh and just for you I did figure out my situation on my own. I have no control over what I am taught if I did i never would have gone to school. OH and by the way GO **** YOURSELF!! I get where you are coming from I just fel sorry for the other people who could benifit from your vast knowledge but you feel they are leeches of the system too lazy to figure it out for themselves. If it was easy everyone would do it. RIGHT?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I use about 5 cfh, gas lens, #4 cup, 14 to 33 amps average purged at about 2 cfh on the steel tuned exhaust pipes I make.
                    I used 10 to 12 cfh, 48 amps dc #6 cup gas lens, purged at 5 cfh when I was welding stainless tube in the dairies.

                    More gas flow isnt necessarily good as stated above.

                    I will try to post pics of the pipe fitting .062 steel coupler to .022 steel tube, butt welded and purged.

                    They are grey in color but 100% penetration, no porosity using the 5 cfh setting above.
                    Attached Files
                    Last edited by popspipes; 08-30-2010, 09:37 PM.
                    mike sr

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It's crybaby wanttobe "welders" who demand to be "spoon fed" information that make one question whether it's even worth trying to help.

                      No two flowmeters will read "exactly" the same.

                      Size cup, amps, tungsten size, material and filler, etc, etc. all affect the flow rate as well as the preflow and postflow.

                      A flowrate which works fine in a perfectly still area will generally be insufficient in an area with even slight breezes.

                      Pro mod you've got a lot to learn about welding and life in general. Might start by trying not to act like a punk.
                      Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                      Dynasty 200 DX
                      Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                      Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                      Hobart HH187
                      Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                      Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                      Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                      PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                      Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                      Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                      More grinders than hands

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by pro mod steve View Post
                        Hey SUNDOWN I am still sort of a noob when it comes to tig welding. Sorry I wasn't born with a tig torch in my mouth. I wasn't looking for exact numbers just some info from people more experienced than me. Oh and just for you I did figure out my situation on my own. I have no control over what I am taught if I did i never would have gone to school. OH and by the way GO **** YOURSELF!! I get where you are coming from I just fel sorry for the other people who could benifit from your vast knowledge but you feel they are leeches of the system too lazy to figure it out for themselves. If it was easy everyone would do it. RIGHT?
                        Chill out man.

                        Sundown is right. Your tig instructor should have versed you in flow rates. But he backed it up with sage advice.
                        Nothing welded, Nothing gained

                        Miller Dynasty700DX
                        3 ea. Miller Dynasty350DX
                        Miller Dynasty200DX
                        ThermalArc 400 GTSW
                        MillerMatic350P
                        MillerMatic200 with spoolgun
                        MKCobraMig260
                        Lincoln SP-170T
                        Linde UCC305 (sold 2011)
                        Hypertherm 1250
                        Hypertherm 800
                        PlasmaCam CNC cutter
                        Fadal Toolroom CNC Mill
                        SiberHegner CNC Mill
                        2 ea. Bridgeport
                        LeBlond 15" Lathe
                        Haberle 18" Cold Saw
                        Doringer 14" Cold Saw
                        6 foot x 12 foot Mojave granite

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Pro Mod Steve,

                          I got to say, that aside from having a smart mouth, with nothing to back it up, you are good for a really good laugh.

                          Just for S&G I went back and checked out a few of your posts to see what this "smart mouth" kid brings to the table.

                          I see in another post where you think you're worth $65/hr for your fantastic welding skills. LMAO. If you don't even know how to set your own flow rate, I seriously question how many other things you really don't know about welding.

                          I definitely can understand why you wouldn't post a location. If you did, I'm sure there are some "much more qualified guys" who'd be moving there to get in on some of that action.
                          Syncrowave 250 DX Tigrunner
                          Dynasty 200 DX
                          Miller XMT 304 w/714D Feeder & Optima Control
                          Miller MM 251 w/Q300 & 30A SG
                          Hobart HH187
                          Dialarc 250 AC/DC
                          Hypertherm PM 600 & 1250
                          Wilton 7"x12" bandsaw
                          PC Dry Cut Saw, Dewalt Chop Saw
                          Milwaukee 8" Metal Cut Saw, Milwaukee Portaband.
                          Thermco and Smith (2) Gas Mixers
                          More grinders than hands

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by pro mod steve View Post
                            Hey SUNDOWN I am still sort of a noob when it comes to tig welding. Sorry I wasn't born with a tig torch in my mouth. I wasn't looking for exact numbers just some info from people more experienced than me. Oh and just for you I did figure out my situation on my own. I have no control over what I am taught if I did i never would have gone to school. OH and by the way GO **** YOURSELF!! I get where you are coming from I just fel sorry for the other people who could benifit from your vast knowledge but you feel they are leeches of the system too lazy to figure it out for themselves. If it was easy everyone would do it. RIGHT?
                            That was really a good reply that is sure to get you more help in the future.

                            Griff

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by SundownIII View Post
                              1. Your "instructor" should have taught you how to determine your optimal flow rate. Don't know how you expect anyone else to tell you where to set your flow rate. Depends on the situation.

                              2. Some posters must either work for the "gas supplier" or don't know jack about tig welding. Too much gas flow can be just as bad or worse than not enough.

                              Depending on cup size, stickout, etc keep dropping your flow rate by about 2CFH until you start to see porosity in your "test bead". Bump it back up till the porosity disappears. That's your base. I normally run about 3-5CFH higher than my base.

                              Using helium or a helium/argon mix is going to require a much higher flow rate due to the specific gravity (lighter than air) of the He.
                              Just because we run our gas at 30 doesn't mean we don't know jack about tig welding. Why do we run it at 30? Because it's always been at 30. When I started at this shop 25 years ago the foreman said run em at 30. The welds have always come out great so it was never questioned. Now we do have a breeze running through our shop and we don't have gas lens cups so that might have something to do with it. Next chance I get I am going to do the test bead and change to cfh like you suggest and see what I come up with. Oh and your working for the gas supplier crack gave me a good chuckle.

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