Using a Dynasty 700 for thin aluminium

[brians]

I'm new to the forum so I'll first say hi to all members.

I've had a Dynasty 700 for about 2 months now. It replaced my Syncowave 350. Most of my work consists of welding aluminium ranging from 1/8 to 5/8 inches thick. The Dynasty is unbelievable. It is literally 10-fold better than the 350. I normally keep it set at 325 amps with the balance at 75 and the frequency at 275 and it will blow holes through 1/2 inch aluminium if I'm not careful. The ball on the end of the tungsten stays small so you can weld in very close the the work. A side benefit is it puts out much less heat to the hands. I can wear thin TIG gloves without burning anything.

My question, every so often I need to weld very thin aluminium (it's air conditionig ducting in radar enclosure). I have not yet determined how to set the machine to get good welds. Has anyone tried this.

Thanks in advance.

Brian

[fun4now]

just wanted to say welcome :D

[shadetreewelder]

How thin is thin. The thinnest I have welded with my D300DX is 14 ga.

[KB Fabrications]

You already say you can weld 1/8" to 1/2" using the same settings?:confused: Are you just setting the machine and modulating current with the amptrol? If so, no wonder you are blowing holes thru whatever you are doing.

The BASIC's tell you that you set your machine at 1 amp for every .001" of material thickness. That is just a starting point but it will get you close and other factors come into play such as joint configuration, ambient temp, etc. I personally like to set my amperage at just a hair over what is called for so I have more control over what I am doing. How long have you been welding?

[weld-tek]

You already say you can weld 1/8" to 1/2" using the same settings?:confused: Are you just setting the machine and modulating current with the amptrol? If so, no wonder you are blowing holes thru whatever you are doing.

The BASIC's tell you that you set your machine at 1 amp for every .001" of material thickness. That is just a starting point but it will get you close and other factors come into play such as joint configuration, ambient temp, etc. I personally like to set my amperage at just a hair over what is called for so I have more control over what I am doing. How long have you been welding?




GLAD TO SEE YOU BACK KB

[brians]

KB,

I guess I didn't elaborate enough. In general I set the machine for 325 amps then use the foot pedal for the actual control. I do tweek the amperage/balance/frequency to some degree depending on what I am welding but I have found with the Dynasty 700 that 325 is a good base setting for most of my work. On one ocassion I cranked it up to 500 amps inorder to get good penetration on some thick baseplates (firmly clampe to a large heatsink). BTW, I am using a 320 amp rated torch.

I have been welding for many years, working ~10 hours days, 6 days a week. With my Syncowave 350, I never had any trouble with the thin aluminium. The Dynasty tends to blow the metal away when the torch first starts. I have tried many amp settings (in the 50 range) and played alot with the balance and frequency but I still cannot match the results of the 350.

Is this any clearer or am I just talking in circles:D ?

Brian

[KB Fabrications]

KB,

I guess I didn't elaborate enough. In general I set the machine for 325 amps then use the foot pedal for the actual control. I do tweek the amperage/balance/frequency to some degree depending on what I am welding but I have found with the Dynasty 700 that 325 is a good base setting for most of my work. On one ocassion I cranked it up to 500 amps inorder to get good penetration on some thick baseplates (firmly clampe to a large heatsink). BTW, I am using a 320 amp rated torch.

I have been welding for many years, working ~10 hours days, 6 days a week. With my Syncowave 350, I never had any trouble with the thin aluminium. The Dynasty tends to blow the metal away when the torch first starts. I have tried many amp settings (in the 50 range) and played alot with the balance and frequency but I still cannot match the results of the 350.

Is this any clearer or am I just talking in circles:D ?

Brian
Yep, that is a little clearer, thanks. The Dynasty's (inverters in general) want to start a puddle almost instantly so you may have to even go as low as say, 30 amps? I would just experiment with going lower than you would normally think in order to maintain control over the puddle on your thin stuff. Like I said above, I prefer to set my machine to just a little over what I think I will need for a given thickness, especially on aluminum. That way I don't blow through. It may take a few seconds longer to get going but I prefer to do it that way.

[shadetreewelder]

Yep, that is a little clearer, thanks. The Dynasty's (inverters in general) want to start a puddle almost instantly so you may have to even go as low as say, 30 amps? I would just experiment with going lower than you would normally think in order to maintain control over the puddle on your thin stuff. Like I said above, I prefer to set my machine to just a little over what I think I will need for a given thickness, especially on aluminum. That way I don't blow through. It may take a few seconds longer to get going but I prefer to do it that way.

Hi Kevin!

In addition, I have noticed with my older transformers, Syn 300 and 180, you could get by with a larger tungsten whereas with the Dynasty (inverter) I had to go down a size with the tungsten when welding thinner materials. I also do what KB does and set the machine just over what I will need for starters, that will give you more control at the low end.

The range on the D700 is 5-700 amps so the machine can go low. Also your potentiometer in your pedal may be dirty or worn if that is the case it may be giving you fits on the signal to the power source.

[fun4now]

cant you ajust the arc starts in the dyn. machines? seems like i have herd of people going into the hiden programs to reajust the arc starts for softer starts. no idea how its done , just thought it werth mentioning. i'm shore a quick call to millers TIG Tec. guys could walk ya threw it.

[KB Fabrications]

brians,

James brings up a good point. I don't know how the 700's work but on my 300DX (soon to be 350DX :) ) you can adjust tig start amperage by accessing a hidden menu upon start-up. You can also adjust Tig start polarity between positive and negative. I do this on occasion for tricky stuff, might be worth A try. You can always go back to your original parameters or restore to factory defaults.

[fun4now]

golly, i'm so smart i scare myself some times.:p
just playing, i hope you get it worked out. if not you could always pick up a dyn200 for the lil stuff, just send it to me when your done figureing out how to do it with the 700.:D

[chub380]

You can adjust the starts on the 300 but I never have. I agree with Brian that the dynasty tries to blow holes on thin alum I have done down to 26/28 gage with no problem; but I am not sure how much thinner I could do with my skill. I tried to weld two soda cans togethther one time and the high freq arc blew a hole in the can before I could get started with the bead. I finally got the can tacked by laying the filler in the joint first. Does or has anyone on here ever changed the start parameters on their 300. Chub

[KB Fabrications]

Does or has anyone on here ever changed the start parameters on their 300. Chub

Yes, as stated earlier.


.........you can adjust tig start amperage by accessing a hidden menu upon start-up. You can also adjust Tig start polarity between positive and negative. I do this on occasion for tricky stuff, might be worth A try.

[EvanK]

I've welded 20ish gauge on a buddys 700, Im not sure of the amps he set it up.

[spotsineyes]

golly, i'm so smart i scare myself some times.:p
just playing, i hope you get it worked out. if not you could always pick up a dyn200 for the lil stuff, just send it to me when your done figureing out how to do it with the 700.:D
Even better, just send the 700 to me, and I'll figure out the thin stuff settings for you, and I'll send it back to you as soon as possible.

[brians]

Thanks for all the feedback!

I'll look into adjusting the starting amperage. I know I can set it to ramp up to the desired amperage using the front panel controls. I tried it but it is the same as using the foot pedal. It appears that the starting amperage is proportional to the amperage setting on the front panel. If I set the amperage to around 20 amps it fires up fine and doesn't blow the metal away. If I kick it up to 70 amps (I need this in certain areas) the starting amperage seems to increase and it blows thru the metal. It seems to make sense and, also, I realize the 700 was probably not designed targeting such thin metal.

If I can't figure it out it's good to know some of you kind souls will be happy to take if off my hands. As much as I'd like to give it away, I think I'll hang onto it. If you weld aluminium on a regular basis it's the greatest machine in the world. At my company we have 2 Dynasty 700's and one Aerowave. We had 2 Aerowave's but one of them died and they wanted 3500.00 to fix it.

Again, thanks for the help.

Brian

[KB Fabrications]

Thanks for all the feedback!

I'll look into adjusting the starting amperage. I know I can set it to ramp up to the desired amperage using the front panel controls. I tried it but it is the same as using the foot pedal. It appears that the starting amperage is proportional to the amperage setting on the front panel. If I set the amperage to around 20 amps it fires up fine and doesn't blow the metal away. If I kick it up to 70 amps (I need this in certain areas) the starting amperage seems to increase and it blows thru the metal. It seems to make sense and, also, I realize the 700 was probably not designed targeting such thin metal.

If I can't figure it out it's good to know some of you kind souls will be happy to take if off my hands. As much as I'd like to give it away, I think I'll hang onto it. If you weld aluminium on a regular basis it's the greatest machine in the world. At my company we have 2 Dynasty 700's and one Aerowave. We had 2 Aerowave's but one of them died and they wanted 3500.00 to fix it.

Again, thanks for the help.

Brian

Check your machine to see if you are starting in electrode positive or electrode negative on the AC side. Defalt for the 300 is on EP and I would be curious to learn what the 700 default is. I also would be curious to learn that start amperage on the 700 is somehow synergic with the machine amperage setting. The factory default for start amperage (AC) on my 300 is 40 amps but can go as low as 5 amps. I suspect the 700 would be capable of similar settings and can't imagine why they would tie the two together like that. If your 700 is also factory set at 40 amps to start, and you have the machine at 70 amps, then you don't have a very big window there.

Using the sequencer (ramping up like you described) is not the answer. Playing with the parameters I described above should get you the results you are looking for.

[fun4now]

i would suspect if you have ajusted the starts as KB Fabrications explained it (much better than i did:o ) and you are still haveing problems the foot control might be an isue. its possible its not picking up on the start for some reason and is jumping the amps when it finaly kicks in.
be shore to let us know how it all turns out.

[LAN]

:D
Dynasty starting parameters are accessed by turning the machine off and while powering the machine back up, you hold down the process and amperage button. This will access the menu that will control the starting parameters. Also, if you are looking to use the sequencer module you need to have the machine set in remote 2T.
For welding thin aluminum the Triangular waveform works really well.
Here is the page in the manual that will run you thru that procedure of changing the start parameters. And be sure that you are not using a pure tungsten.
http://millerwelds.com/om/o2250f_mil.pdf
Page #41

Good luck:D

Brad

[brians]

Solved:D :D :D

You guys were on the money. I actually read the manual (how many people actual read them - be honest) and it explained how to set the starting amperage. I read thru the manual when I first got the machine but I just glanced over this section as I wasn't clear what is was telling me and how important it was.

The procedure is simple:
1. Start up the welder
2. Press and hold the "Process" and "Amperage" buttons until "[SEL][EP]" is displayed.
3. Press the "Amerage" button until the led lights up "A".
4. Set the desired start amperage between 5 and 700.

You can set the starting amperage for each of the 4 memory positions (If you're not familiar with the Dynasty, you can save up to 4 sets of parameters and recall them by the push of a button. Great feature).

I set it to 5 (the default was 40). It now welds the thin aluminium (by thin I mean 22 gage) fantastically.

I can now permanently retire my Syncowave 350 as the Dynasty is far, far superior for the work I am doing.

Thanks to everyone who responded, I don't think I would ever had figured it out.

BTW, I use both argon and helium (for the thicker metal) and a 320 amp Speedway TIG torch. This torch is great. It uses the same parts as the WP-20's but has much larger water lines. It remains cool even at 500 amps (continuous).

Brian

[Engloid]

BTW, I use both argon and helium (for the thicker metal) and a 320 amp Speedway TIG torch. This torch is great. It uses the same parts as the WP-20's but has much larger water lines. It remains cool even at 500 amps (continuous).
Brian
Tell me more about the torch. please... cost, price, source, etc...

[brians]

"Speedway" torches are made by Weldcraft. I picked it up at the local welding supply (in San Jose, CA). They don't stock them so it's a special order item. I think I paid about $320 for the torch with hoses (it might have been $340). It's purple in color and the handle is just a bit larger than the normal 25 amp WP-20 torch. I normally use 1/8 inch tungsten but on ocassion I use 5/32.

Brian

[fun4now]

i think i got one of them but its not purple, bummer i might have considerd using it if it was purple.:D
glad you got it worked out.;)

[BlownC6Z]

brians,

James brings up a good point. I don't know how the 700's work but on my 300DX (soon to be 350DX :) ) you can adjust tig start amperage by accessing a hidden menu upon start-up. You can also adjust Tig start polarity between positive and negative. I do this on occasion for tricky stuff, might be worth A try. You can always go back to your original parameters or restore to factory defaults.

If the 350DX will be a replacement for your 300DX I'm an VERY interested buyer for the 300DX. You can contact me at kshupe@cox.net Thanks.

[KB Fabrications]

If the 350DX will be a replacement for your 300DX I'm an VERY interested buyer for the 300DX. You can contact me at kshupe@cox.net Thanks.

My plan has never been to sell the 300DX Tigrunner that I currently have. That said, I wouldn't be opposed to it and would consider an offer. If you are really interested, I would first put you in touch with a guy who I sold a 2 year old 200DX to. He is very happy with the machine and my 300 is in the same, or better, condition. Where are you located and how serious are you. You can contact me at kbfabrications@hotmail.com and I can send you pics of the machine.