burning tungsten

[jake]

i cant seem to figure out why i cant hold an arc

dyn 200dx, DCEN, 100 argon, 1/16 ceratied, #5 cup, 15cfh, set at 100 amps but no matter the amperage it burns it, i can feel the gas coming out i purged the crap out of my lines

i have thought about switching over to aluminum settings to see if it will work, i tried it on lift and hf start i just need to weld some mild steel and cant get it to work????

[boilerman79]

When you say DCEN,Your not switching the cables around are you?As I read the manual[which i should have done months ago] you dont switch leads around to get the proper polarity,the machine automatocally adjusts as to where you have the push buttons selected.Facing the machine the stinger or tig torch should always be hooked up to the righthand dinse connector.The ground to the left.If you arent switching the leads and have the right polarity I dont have a clue to why your tungsten is burning,but it sounds like a polarity issue.I have tigged some alum.and a little stainless with no issues so far.[except operator error]:D

[jake]

yeah the polarity correct i havent tried going to aluminum settings to see if it willl work im thinkin about resetting the machine to defaults to see if something went goofy there i just dont know??

[projectwelder]

Hopefully you are on shiny steel before you start. What is the arc behaving like? Is the tungsten changing color or melting back? Have you tried connecting your ground directly to the piece?

[Nitro_Pirate]

stupid question, but what kind of gas are you using and how much?

[c wagner]

i cant seem to figure out why i cant hold an arc

dyn 200dx, DCEN, 100 argon, 1/16 ceratied, #5 cup, 15cfh, set at 100 amps but no matter the amperage it burns it, i can feel the gas coming out i purged the crap out of my lines

i have thought about switching over to aluminum settings to see if it will work, i tried it on lift and hf start i just need to weld some mild steel and cant get it to work????

stupid question, but what kind of gas are you using and how much?

My guess is 100% Argon at 15 cfh but that's just a guess.:rolleyes:

What kind of tungsten prep are you doing?

[Nitro_Pirate]

i would personally bump the flow up to about 30-35 and make sure you sharpen the tungsten to a pencil tip with all of the lines from either the sander or grinding wheel facing up and down the tungsten not going in a circle around it

[Craig in Denver]

i would personally bump the flow up to about 30-35Sooo, you don't pay for the argon, eh? :eek:

[SundownIII]

Why would anyone recommend 30-35 CFH of Argon thru a #5 cup.

Kinda makes me wonder if he's ever done any tig welding.

[bvweld]

Sooo, you don't pay for the argon, eh? :eek:

Nothing like a little breeze while your runnin those beads :D :eek:

[Nitro_Pirate]

i didn't even read the number 5 lens, my bad

[Craig in Denver]

Nothing like a little breeze while your runnin those beads :D :eek:Hey, good idea. It's hot as hades in my little 4 x 4 class cube with the curtain closed, even with the exhaust fan on. :o Oh, wait a minute, I can't breathe argon. :eek:

[Dad]

Hey guys,
Are some of you a little cranky lately? I agree that he missed the argon, cfh, and gas cup size, and I'll also agree that the suggested cfh setting is way too high, but you guys need a to mellow a little. :rolleyes: Oh, and to the original poster: switching to try aluminum, will direct more heat to your tungsten, most definately making your problem worse. There is not enough info to diagnose your arc problem, but you might want to increase your post flow a little, to help with the tugsten burning ( if it's getting discolored, and not melting during welding ) Also, not knowing what setting you played with, I would say to go back to defaults aand try that, like you mentioned.

[jake]

dang no net service !!

im sharpening the tungsten on a belt sander like ive always done in the direction of the tungsten, 2-2.5x the diameter, base metal is cleaned up with 120grit sanding wheel to nice and shiney bright, theres only about 500psi of gas left i was gonna switch to my new bottle if i get a chance tonight to see if that changes anything, tung is turning black if i remember and arc is very erratic it goes everywhere, im pretty sure the material isnt magnetized, im gonna get some more material tonight also to see if that makes a differnce but a few weeks ago i did tig some of this tubing and it was fine, i forgot to check my torch for leaks im gonna do that tonight also

hmm what am i forgetting??

[PJinNJ]

Try a larger Tungsten, 1/16 at 100amps is the end of the envelope, go to 3/32 or even 1/8. AND DON'T use pure tungsten, it'll help you avoid the balling.

[jake]

im gonna try a larger one usually when ive done 1/8" miled steel in the past the 1/16 worked just fine i usually just use orange or blue band.

[Cowbungus]

i cant seem to figure out why i cant hold an arc

dyn 200dx, DCEN, 100 argon, 1/16 ceratied, #5 cup, 15cfh, set at 100 amps but no matter the amperage it burns it, i can feel the gas coming out i purged the crap out of my lines

i have thought about switching over to aluminum settings to see if it will work, i tried it on lift and hf start i just need to weld some mild steel and cant get it to work????I have a Maxstar 200DX.. and I have used your settings along with the 1/16 ceratied tungsten. I would change the cup size to a 6 or 7.. up the argon to 17cfh. The post flow should be at least 10 seconds. Do not tilt the nozzle more than 10 to 15 degrees. Just my opinion and what i have used.

[Miller Brad]

If your tungsten is turning colors while welding there is some form of contamination present. This contamination can come from base material, gas contamination, pinholes in your gas lines, improper cleaning techniques, or even welding in a place that is windy (shielding gas being blown away). Turning your gas flow up can actually cause more problems with contamination due to turbulence in the arc, from a too high of gas flow sucking in outside contaminants. For welding on mild steel you should be somewhere around 15CFH. Having a post flow of 10 seconds is a great suggestion! Typical postflow should be about 1 second per 10 amps of welding current (100A=10 seconds of postflow).
--Contamination from base material--
This contamination can come from a mill scale being present on your material. If your material has mill scale it is very common for this scale to flake up when the high temperatures of the welding arc get close to it. This scale will often fly up and hit your tungsten causing your arc to turn a greenish color, and your tungsten to be contaminated. This mill scale should be removed before welding. It will make a huge difference.
--Contamination from gas--
This contamination can come from a bad bottle of gas (which does happen from time to time), pinholes in your torch leads (which causes a vacuum effect, and will suck all sorts of contaminants from the shop air through your torch, including other forms of gas), connections that are not tightened like they should be (which can cause this same vacuum effect), or the wrong gas all together (most commonly 75/25 Ar/Co2). A good place to start, when a gas contamination issue is suspected is at the gas bottle, and work your way to the torch, checking all of your fittings to make sure that they are tight, and your gas hoses that they do not have holes or suspicious marks.
--Contamination due to improper cleaning techniques--
Contamination can also come from solvents that people use to clean their material before welding. Even though they don't look like it, metals are very porous. The pores of the material being welded can definitely absorb solvents. When a welding arc is brought close to the material where this solvent is, it burns, bubbles, and causes contamination. Typically I use no solvents for cleaning before welding because of this problem.
--Tungsten degradation and preparation--
If your tungsten is balling up while welding on DC, you are on the wrong polarity of DC. On the Dynasty 200, the TIG torch should be in the Dinse connection that is right under where the gas hose comes out. This is the position that the torch stays in for all applications (Unless you are welding on DCEP and like to use 1/4" tungsten at 100 amps):eek:. If this application requires 100 amps of welding current a 1/16" tungsten will handle that no problem. I just got done welding with a 1/16" tungsten at 150 amps on DCEN. There was no visible damage to the tungsten. Typical degradation to tungsten while welding at too high of amperage on DCEN is the tip of the tungsten getting spit off. It usually will not ball, but get really ratty looking. Tungsten prep is also something that is critical. If the tungsten is prepared on a wheel that has been used for steel or other materials there is a potential for contamination.

Hopefully some of these things help in troubleshooting this problem. If not PM me and I'll get in contact with you directly. We'll see if we can narrow it down. ;)

[jake]

thanks everone for the help im gonna get out there in a bit to try some things imhaving a feeling i got the gas up to high since now that i think of it i had some times the arc going everywhere im thinkin its gettin blown around then the tung is getting burned up. since my base metal is clean ive used this bottle or argon, work clamp is right on the material so im gonna back the gas down i just never thought too much gas would act like this if this is the case, if this dosnt work ill get ahold of ya in the morning brad!!

[jake]

ok still no luck im gonna get a new belt for the belt sander tommorow im wondering if someone else used it for what the big arse sign above it says not to use it for!!

i checked all my gas connections, changed to a new bottle of argon, checked over torch lead,

tungsten is turning dark grey and you cant hold an arc its all over the place and burning holes in clean base material. and there are sparks coming off as you increase the power seems like about half way down the pedal is when the sparks come out so ill try again with a new belt and see if that helps

[xyzdonna]

I like to use 3/32" two percent thoriated for everything. Is there any disadvantage to this as opposed to 1/8"? It might help with the problem here although he seems to have tried everything else and 100 amps shouldn't require 3/32". I might also suggest trying new filler rods, might be some contamination from that as well. Of course you need to clean the joint area real good before welding, but that is a given.
Take care,
xyzdonna

[Laiky]

Silly question:

Are you sure of the tungsten your using? Have you tried other tungsten from a different package? or just fresh? I prefer Lanthanated for everything, not that i think tungsten type is causing the greying or sparking, but maybe fresh tungsten from a different source will help.

[jake]

yeah im sure of the tungsten, i used ones out of this package about a month ago on the same material and it worked like it should have

ive got the new belt on the grinder but no change its doing the same thing

[jake]

I like to use 3/32" two percent thoriated for everything. Is there any disadvantage to this as opposed to 1/8"? It might help with the problem here although he seems to have tried everything else and 100 amps shouldn't require 3/32". I might also suggest trying new filler rods, might be some contamination from that as well. Of course you need to clean the joint area real good before welding, but that is a given.
Take care,
xyzdonna


ive always been told to use the minium size tungsten, 100 amps is about the top limit for 1/16 i had the machine set to 100 but didnt have the pedal all the way down, also i wont use thoriated since i dont have the proper equipment to deal with the radioactive dust and there are soo many great alternatives. i havent been using any filler since i cant even hold an arc

[jake]

ok i finally found out what was going on!!!!!!!


my #5 nozzle was SOOO tight on the ferrule that not enough gas was getting through. it was soo tight i though i was gonna break it getting it apart, how it got this tight i have no clue! but i put it back togethor after it being apart and its back to making beads like its supposed to!


thanks everyone for your help!

[SundownIII]

Jake,

Thanks for posting your findings. Always helps.:)